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Forum Home > General Discussion > Flea/Tick & Heartworm Prevention

Mmwagner
Member
Posts: 20

I looked through the Forum, and found a lot of info, but am kind of looking for a more straightforward answer. Are there brands we should be avoiding? Should we administer to EPI dogs at all? I'm in Ohio, and we have lots of ticks in the summer. I've tried using essential oils on Myles collar, and that isn't very effevtive.  I also read where some are giving their pups milk thistle when they give flea/tick/heartworm meds....please advise.

Word of warning...now that I've figured out how to add a pic, you will get to see our sweet Myles all the time...lol

--


Update 2/27/17 :Current weight 33lbs. Eating TOTW High Prairie...Currently 3 cups daily, would like 2-3 more lbs before giving recommended amount. Probiotic Miracle 363 grams daily (1 scoop) Metamucil as needed.

Aussie/Beagle Myles 1 yr 10 mos  diagnosed 1/14/17 after dealing with symptoms approx 4 mos. 

Normal weight 36lbs current weight 23.5lbs, update 1/27/17 27 lbs! Woohoo!

TLI Less than 1.0, Folate 6.6, Cobalamin Less than 150

B12 started 1/10, giving weekly for 6 weeks. Started Pancreatin 6x  1/19/17, Currently eating California Naturals Chicken & Rice Formula (2.5% Fiber)...transitioning to TOTW High Prairie. Currently feeding 50/50, and going well.(1/27/17)

Melanie



February 21, 2017 at 4:09 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Doc's Mom
Administrator
Posts: 2608
We love the pics - bring me on!! He's adorable by the way!! Several of us dongive our EPI dogs flea/tick and heartworm meds - it's really a personal choice. I know some use the Seresto collar with good results. I use Frontline and Sentinel and I give milk thistle for a week when I give the meds. I also give the meds at different times - I give Frontline on the 8th and Sentinel on the 20th. Madelon
--

MADELON and DOC aka "BUBBY WUBBY"

Nashville, Tennessee

DOB: 4/3/2014 - Diagnosed EPI and SIBO: 5/22/2015
EPI Test Results: 1st test 7/2014 = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate > 24; 
2nd test 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24; 3rd test 10/2015   TLI < .4; B12 >1000; Folate 14.4

Weight: 95 (highest 1/2015) - 76 (lowest 5/2015) - goal met 100lb (7/23/15) - 101.8LBS 12/3/15 - CHUNKY MONKEY

History prior to DX:  May/June 2014 (2mos old) - DX coccidia and bladder infection; July 2014 (3mos old) 1st EPI test = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate >24 - Diagnosed SIBO not EPI; Feb 2015 thru May 2015 - weight loss only; May  2015 vomitted several times, diarrhea and eating poop.

History since DX: has maintained weight between 95-101lbs since July 2015; extreme yeast and rod infection in ears; yeast infection paws (ongoing); bacterial eye infection; bacterial skin infection on legs; poops LIVE fly larvae; diagnosed with mild, focal superficial pyoderma (bacterial infection) - rare lesions on inner thighs; bacterial and yeast overgrowth lip folds; yeast overgrowth feet and left ear; metacarpal/metatarsal draining tracts/fistulae (infection and/or immune mediated disease; probable underlying allergy (food vs. environmental ); staphylococcus pseudintermedius infection in sores on paws; recurring metatarsal fistula - all issues resolved after NutriScan Food Sensitivity Test and switching foods.

NUTRISCAN Food Sensitivity Test (12/2015): reactive to chicken, turkey, white fish, wheat, white potato (mild), venison, soy (mild), pork (mild), duck (mild), corn - switching food based on test resolved all skin issues.

Serum Allergy Test (5/2016): Too many to mention

CURRENTLY :  6 cups Forza10 Legend Skin - Diane 6x 1tsp per cup; 1 WonderLab PetFactor B12 2x day; 2 scoops TotalBiotics 1x day; 600mg vitamin E; 1 Zyrtec 10mg 2x day; Milk Thistle during heartworm/flea/tick meds

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions are based on my personal experiences, information gleaned from EPI research and information from other EPI owners.  Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet

SO THANKfUL FOR OUR EPI4DOGS GUARDIAN ANGELS!!!!!!!!

YOUR PAWS LEFT PRINTS ON MY HEART (in loving memory of Bugsy aka Boo Boo - Boston Terrier 14yrs - not EPI but medically challenging and totally worth it)


February 21, 2017 at 5:06 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Mmwagner
Member
Posts: 20

We've done Heartgard in the past, with a little tummy upset, and used to use Frontline, but that really upset his tummy. Tried Nexgard right before Myles started getting sick, so I'm not sure really if that upset his tummy, or it was the EPI. He hasn' t been on anything since September, but it's getting to be that time again. If others aren't using traditional flea/tick/heartworm meds, what are they doing? And how is Milk Thistle dispensed? I'm all for natural if possible....

February 21, 2017 at 6:02 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Gaucho's mom
Member
Posts: 5
If Miles is an Aussie mix you need to test him for MDR-1 mutation before giving him Ivermectin (Heart garden, etc). Ivermectin can be deadly to dogs with the mutation, common in collie type dogs and Aussies. I use Springtime Bug Off chewable and Nemo, with poor results.
--
Barbara Gaucho Australian Shepherd born 12/12/2008 Diagnosed with EPI 12/17/16 weight 48.8 pounds cTLI 1.6, cobalt in 221 foliate 10.5 Currently on enzymes (just switched to enzyme diane 6x 1 top per cup), tylosin and B12 injection today Current weight 57.6 pounds Eating 6 cups Canidae Pure Sea per day
February 21, 2017 at 6:56 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16335

My rule of thumb when it comes to tck and flea meds.... is use something that has a good reputation BUT

1. stay away from anything that is a combo product (includes both tick & flea and heartworm med).... these are not good to use on dogs with health concerns because it is too much poison adminstered all at once on your dog and these are the products that have high death rates vs. other simple tick and flea treatments.

2. stay away from the tick and flea treatments that you only have to apply once every 3 months, or once every 6 months or once a year.  Same problem, high death rate especially in compromised dogs because these products have too much concentrated poison in them to give all at once.


Stick with products that are given once a month and are not combos.  

FYI.... the product mentioned above (Frontline, FrontlinPlus, Seresto collar and Sentinal) are all good products that work .

--

Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

February 21, 2017 at 11:01 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Mmwagner
Member
Posts: 20

Thank you everyone...and especially Gaucho's mom. I didn't know that about Aussie breeds. I will make sure to stay away from Ivermectin...just in case. So, I looked up sentinal and seresto. Both are collars from what I can tell. Would that make them slightly less toxic? And, how would that work with 2 different collars being worn?

Thanks, Melanie

February 22, 2017 at 8:38 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Doc's Mom
Administrator
Posts: 2608
Hmmm - Sentinel is a once a month pill not a collar for heartworm prevention. I use Sentinel for my lab/collie non-EPI girl because it does not contain ivermectin. Seresto is the flea/tick collar. Madelon
--

MADELON and DOC aka "BUBBY WUBBY"

Nashville, Tennessee

DOB: 4/3/2014 - Diagnosed EPI and SIBO: 5/22/2015
EPI Test Results: 1st test 7/2014 = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate > 24; 
2nd test 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24; 3rd test 10/2015   TLI < .4; B12 >1000; Folate 14.4

Weight: 95 (highest 1/2015) - 76 (lowest 5/2015) - goal met 100lb (7/23/15) - 101.8LBS 12/3/15 - CHUNKY MONKEY

History prior to DX:  May/June 2014 (2mos old) - DX coccidia and bladder infection; July 2014 (3mos old) 1st EPI test = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate >24 - Diagnosed SIBO not EPI; Feb 2015 thru May 2015 - weight loss only; May  2015 vomitted several times, diarrhea and eating poop.

History since DX: has maintained weight between 95-101lbs since July 2015; extreme yeast and rod infection in ears; yeast infection paws (ongoing); bacterial eye infection; bacterial skin infection on legs; poops LIVE fly larvae; diagnosed with mild, focal superficial pyoderma (bacterial infection) - rare lesions on inner thighs; bacterial and yeast overgrowth lip folds; yeast overgrowth feet and left ear; metacarpal/metatarsal draining tracts/fistulae (infection and/or immune mediated disease; probable underlying allergy (food vs. environmental ); staphylococcus pseudintermedius infection in sores on paws; recurring metatarsal fistula - all issues resolved after NutriScan Food Sensitivity Test and switching foods.

NUTRISCAN Food Sensitivity Test (12/2015): reactive to chicken, turkey, white fish, wheat, white potato (mild), venison, soy (mild), pork (mild), duck (mild), corn - switching food based on test resolved all skin issues.

Serum Allergy Test (5/2016): Too many to mention

CURRENTLY :  6 cups Forza10 Legend Skin - Diane 6x 1tsp per cup; 1 WonderLab PetFactor B12 2x day; 2 scoops TotalBiotics 1x day; 600mg vitamin E; 1 Zyrtec 10mg 2x day; Milk Thistle during heartworm/flea/tick meds

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions are based on my personal experiences, information gleaned from EPI research and information from other EPI owners.  Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet

SO THANKfUL FOR OUR EPI4DOGS GUARDIAN ANGELS!!!!!!!!

YOUR PAWS LEFT PRINTS ON MY HEART (in loving memory of Bugsy aka Boo Boo - Boston Terrier 14yrs - not EPI but medically challenging and totally worth it)


February 22, 2017 at 9:47 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Jill
Administrator
Posts: 3499
On the herding breeds I have always heard the saying "4 white feet, don't treat". If it is a controversial drug stay away from it or test. Kiya is aussie/blue heeler with 4 white feet. You can go online to Washington state university vet med area and order an inexpensive cheek swab test to do and send back in. It checks for the MDR1 gene. Kiya was negative so she was on heartguard. Now both dogs are on Interceptor.
--

   Jill-  Washington State

Mickey 6/21/99 - 8/29/2014 

17.5 lb  jack russell, chronic pancreatitis, hyperuricosuria,high blood pressure, hypothyroid, spinal stenosis

diet of  hard boiled eggs, macaroni,  RC Hepatic, mashed potato

2 #2 Dianes enzymes 6x premeal

 2.5 mg Amlodipine, .15mg soloxine am/pm, 100mg ursodiol started for gall bladder thinning

arthritis:  6.25mg tramadol 1x/day, 12.5mg gabapentin every 12 hrs,  Assisi soft loop used on back and elbow, 1- 540meq potassium citrate nightly

Denamarin once a day, 1/16 t tylan (150mg)  2x/day ,  Senilife started 12/14/13, Trixsyn sirup for arthritis, .1mg Adequan weekly by shot. 75mg Tylan 2x./day for SIBO

Optimmune for Dry eyes

 Kiya is Mickeys sister, 3/4 aussie, 1/4 blue heeler born 9/2006.  She thinks she is a 44 lb jack russell who tries to heel Mickey!!

TJ is the newest addition.  He is in the bottom picture with Kiya.  He was born 7/05/2015. 

I am not a vet, just a pet owner sharing what experiences I have had in helping my dogs with other pet owners.  If you have an emergency please call your vet.




 photo 20160731_182901_zpsl5p1zcbs.jpg



February 22, 2017 at 10:10 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Patsy
Member
Posts: 853

All my friends say British fleas seem to be immune to Frontline, my vets say so  too,  Both my dogs when on frontline, had fleas for a couple of months, despite me spraying the nooks and crannies in the house and setting off flea bombs and bathing the dogs in flea shampoo .  Now we are using a monthly tablet called simparica,  which I agreed to in desperation.  It's ok so far, but I've read you shouldn't use it for more than a year.  It's  awful dosing them with chemicals. I wouldn't have risked it on Marti with Epi, and her extra auto-immune conditions.  BRavecto, three monthly is  another iffy tablet  one.

--

Marti  Springer Spaniel, owned by Patsy, Sheffield, England.  She died age 12yrs 6mths  on 27/11/14 from heart failure. Diagnosed after three months, when she was 4 years old,she dropped from 24 kilos to 17 kg.  initially she also had protein losing enteropathy, treated with steroids, ,raw sores on back, obsessive thirst, bursting bowels and biadder, then stable after 2 years.   Developed another autoimmune problem with muscular myositis on head ( muscles wasted away, leaving gaunt hollows.)  She also suffered sometimes from  bottom end thrush, anal  gland infections, and recurrent SIBO treated with 4 weeks of oxytetracycline each time. 

Enzymes: Panzym caused mouth problems, resulting in tooth removal , as I didn't know at the time how caustic it was. I changed to one Lypex  then used VetUk Pancreatic Nutrient tablets, and one Chemeyes because it is half the strength, and I didn't need to use two vet uk ones. Then 3 Chemeyes or  2 pancreatic Nutrient  per meal. 

B12 injection monthly.  Trinfac B12 + intrinsic factor capsules from Chemeyes daily. Metacam for knee joints.  Also used Yumpro Bio pre/probiotics.

Food: picky eater,tinned  Chappie saved her life  till she would eat kibble again.  Eden Holistic, Millies Wolfheart and Lily's Kitchen all good,chicken and grain free.

Vets, one caring learner, who had  nervous breakdown, replaced by obnoxious vet , so I rang round  interviewing them to find someone I trusted and would work with us. Since losing Marti and Bob, I have changed again since the good vet us retired.

RIP Bobby the cocker , from PLN.  Present pet, Tinker the fluffy little grey Greek rescue dog. New addition, Jack ,  a neglected rescue terrier, looks like a fox cub and so happy to to be healthy and loved.

 


February 22, 2017 at 4:02 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Mmwagner
Member
Posts: 20

Thanks for the input everyone. And, yes after more searching, you are right Madelon about the Sentinal. I'm doing a  lot of research, and most holistic vets advise against heartworm meds, and actually do blood tests every 3 to 4 months, and then treat if positive. Other studies show heartworm meds to be effective 99% at 45 days and 95% effective at 60 days. I'm also going to look into the MDR1 test.

--


Update 2/27/17 :Current weight 33lbs. Eating TOTW High Prairie...Currently 3 cups daily, would like 2-3 more lbs before giving recommended amount. Probiotic Miracle 363 grams daily (1 scoop) Metamucil as needed.

Aussie/Beagle Myles 1 yr 10 mos  diagnosed 1/14/17 after dealing with symptoms approx 4 mos. 

Normal weight 36lbs current weight 23.5lbs, update 1/27/17 27 lbs! Woohoo!

TLI Less than 1.0, Folate 6.6, Cobalamin Less than 150

B12 started 1/10, giving weekly for 6 weeks. Started Pancreatin 6x  1/19/17, Currently eating California Naturals Chicken & Rice Formula (2.5% Fiber)...transitioning to TOTW High Prairie. Currently feeding 50/50, and going well.(1/27/17)

Melanie



February 22, 2017 at 4:21 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Donna
Member
Posts: 661

Hi Melanie,

Im late to the welcome party, but you've been given good advice!

My favorite saying here is pick your poison, and unfortunately, it's true...one in three dogs here in MA test positive for Lyme during tests also run for heartworm. As I rescue dogs from the south, I'm gritting my teeth for Molly's test in three weeks... I've treated a rescue Bridge dog for heartworm, because I don't believe in the kill method your holistic vet suggested... I've heard of so many who have died in Texas (one of the states I've rescued from), I just don't buy it, but that's MHO.

Like Madelon does, iI dose for either heartworm or flea/tick treatment as far apart as possible. I use heat guard, mainly cuz I've had no bad experience, and either frontline/Advantix alternately, because as Patay said, the bugs seem to get immune to one or the other...

Do your research and pick your poison, or don't, but the consequences are scarey as well....

Domma

February 22, 2017 at 6:56 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Mmwagner
Member
Posts: 20
Thanks Donna...we don't have a holistic vet. I just read that in a holistic dog site. I'm just so worried about Myles now...use prevention, or don't use prevention...ugh. I wish it were a more straightforward answer. He used Heartgard in the past with no issues, but now with what I know about MDR1, I'm afraid to give it to him. And my husband is about to flip with all the added expenses from testing, etc. It doesn't sound like anyone has really been able to prevent successfully with natural remedies.....Melanie
February 22, 2017 at 7:56 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Patsy
Member
Posts: 853

Husbands....... I don't ask how much he spends on his hobby of  cosseting old vehicles, and he doesn't ask me what I spend on dogs.  A tacit agreement!     

--

Marti  Springer Spaniel, owned by Patsy, Sheffield, England.  She died age 12yrs 6mths  on 27/11/14 from heart failure. Diagnosed after three months, when she was 4 years old,she dropped from 24 kilos to 17 kg.  initially she also had protein losing enteropathy, treated with steroids, ,raw sores on back, obsessive thirst, bursting bowels and biadder, then stable after 2 years.   Developed another autoimmune problem with muscular myositis on head ( muscles wasted away, leaving gaunt hollows.)  She also suffered sometimes from  bottom end thrush, anal  gland infections, and recurrent SIBO treated with 4 weeks of oxytetracycline each time. 

Enzymes: Panzym caused mouth problems, resulting in tooth removal , as I didn't know at the time how caustic it was. I changed to one Lypex  then used VetUk Pancreatic Nutrient tablets, and one Chemeyes because it is half the strength, and I didn't need to use two vet uk ones. Then 3 Chemeyes or  2 pancreatic Nutrient  per meal. 

B12 injection monthly.  Trinfac B12 + intrinsic factor capsules from Chemeyes daily. Metacam for knee joints.  Also used Yumpro Bio pre/probiotics.

Food: picky eater,tinned  Chappie saved her life  till she would eat kibble again.  Eden Holistic, Millies Wolfheart and Lily's Kitchen all good,chicken and grain free.

Vets, one caring learner, who had  nervous breakdown, replaced by obnoxious vet , so I rang round  interviewing them to find someone I trusted and would work with us. Since losing Marti and Bob, I have changed again since the good vet us retired.

RIP Bobby the cocker , from PLN.  Present pet, Tinker the fluffy little grey Greek rescue dog. New addition, Jack ,  a neglected rescue terrier, looks like a fox cub and so happy to to be healthy and loved.

 


February 23, 2017 at 4:07 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Riley's Mom
Administrator
Posts: 1821

Hi, sorry I'm late to the party. 

I use a Seresto collar. After much discussion with my vet, we decided that was the best way to go for my girl. We have a lot of trees in our yard and she was getting ticks all the time. The collar works great, no fleas or ticks and she does not seem to have any side effects at all. 

I was just reluctant to add another (besides heartworm) "poision" by mouth due to her compromised state with EPI.

My two cents and personal experience. BTW, RIley has been stable for 2 1/2 years now.

--

Elisabeth

Riley's Mom from Chesapeake, VA

Riley, 8 yr old Labradoodle diagnosed September 2014 cTLI 1.6

Weight before diagnosis 40 lbs, lowest weight 33 lbs, ready for the Chunky Monkey club as she weighed in at a whopping 42 pounds on 12/19/14!

Update: as of 2/25/15 Riley weighs in at 44.2 pounds!

Update: as of 6/15/15 Riley weighs in at 45 pounds!

Feeding grain free kibble TOTW, 1 tsp of Diane's 6x enzymes per cup of food. (I mix the enzymes in something moist). She is a picky eater--lately feeding her on a flat plate is the way to entice her to eat. 1 cup in the am, 2 cups in the pm, 1 tsp of coconut oil per meal, 1 packet of FortiFlora probiotic in the pm meal.

Began weekly B12 shots 10/23/14. 


*I am not a vet, anything I share or suggest on this site is solely from my experience as an EPI dog owner. It is recommended that anything shared or suggested on this forum be discussed with your pet's vet.*

February 23, 2017 at 8:15 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16335

I use Frontline Plus... however.... must share that i too have heard a lot of positive comments from not only vets but pet owners too regarding how pleased they are with the Seresto collar.

--

Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

February 23, 2017 at 10:11 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Buttermom
Administrator
Posts: 2430

Living in south Texas, we must treat our pups for heartworms. Nasty, nasty stuff....  For our pups, we use Heartgard, then two weeks later we give Nexgard. My vet suggested always separating the medications (especially for the little dogs) and always giving with food. My vet is extremely cautious about what we give Butterbean, even suggesting titers rather than vaccines almost immediately after diagnosis. If there is a potential problem, please consult with your vet and test before giving a product. Explain to your husband it is cheaper to test at the front end rather than treat what happens when things go wrong. 

Susan

--

"I am I because my little dog knows me."   Gertrude Stein

Butterbean, Chihuahua born on 06-27-2004, diagnosed in May-June of 2010 via pancreatic biopsy. TLI score of 0.7. Feeding Natural Balance LID Potato and Duck. 1/4 cup with 1/4 tsp of enzymes, twice a day.  She gets a B12 shot every 10 days, and a Wonderlab's capsule every other day.  She gets a maintenance dose of Cosequin every other day. Butter gets 1/4tsp of coconut oil, and a 1/2tsp of Platinum Plus CJ every day. Our new regimen now includes 1mg of prednisone every day, 1/4 tablet (50 mg) of trazodone twice a day, 0.3 ml of omeprazole every day, 1/16th tsp of lactobacillus acidophilus every 3 days, and 500mg of wild salmon oil every other day. 

February 23, 2017 at 10:33 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Jill
Administrator
Posts: 3499

When TJ came to us he wasn't scratching.  But then later that day John turned him over and voila,the little bugger had fleas.  Kiya had been on Frontline Plus and Heartguard, given two weeks apart followed each by a week of milk thistle on the food.  Kiyas FrontlinePlus didn't have an effect on the fleas from TJ and hence he shared them with her.  After 400 later for TJ and a huge rash he got on his chest, I went out of the office with Nexgard.  My vet will not write a prescription for an internet pharmacy like drs. smith so I get it off Vetsource through the vet online.  It is expensive here that way.  Anyway, they both get Nexgard on the 25th and Interceptor Plus on the 12th.  I am having to hold off on the Nexgard because we are having a holistic vet come to the house on Monday to give each their DHLPP, then two weeks after that each their Rabies.  


However I noticed with TJ one of the reactions to the Nexgard is scratching.  i know neither dogs have fleas yet he stops and scratches probably 2 or 3 times a day.  And sometimes one or the other will puke after the pill but it isn't until maybe 3 or 4 days later so I can't probably blame it on the Nexgard and it is not every dose.  


So is it better to hang the "poison" around their neck or ingest it or apply to the  skin?  Why do we have to go through this?  The flea infestation is worse to me and the dogs, JMHO and also I have a friend who I watched her dog go throu the treatment for heartworms and that was not fun.  Hence the Interceptor (now with wormer too in the Plus.


Its funny we have lived in this house we built for 17 years and it is an hour away from facilities.  No one had ever mentioned this holistic vet to me until I asked Bambi the dog groomer here(lol)  She even has a website!  She has a lot of clients in Port Townsend and Sequim.  

I used to give the heartworm preventative according to this: http://www.tibetanmastiff.net/Heartworm.html

however if your dog does get infected during the time you are not dosing them the company will not pay for the treatment.   Just a FYI if that is important.  there are a lot of maps online that have this sort of information.


Melanie, here is the link : http://vcpl.vetmed.wsu.edu/cheek-swab

for the MDR1 gene.

--

   Jill-  Washington State

Mickey 6/21/99 - 8/29/2014 

17.5 lb  jack russell, chronic pancreatitis, hyperuricosuria,high blood pressure, hypothyroid, spinal stenosis

diet of  hard boiled eggs, macaroni,  RC Hepatic, mashed potato

2 #2 Dianes enzymes 6x premeal

 2.5 mg Amlodipine, .15mg soloxine am/pm, 100mg ursodiol started for gall bladder thinning

arthritis:  6.25mg tramadol 1x/day, 12.5mg gabapentin every 12 hrs,  Assisi soft loop used on back and elbow, 1- 540meq potassium citrate nightly

Denamarin once a day, 1/16 t tylan (150mg)  2x/day ,  Senilife started 12/14/13, Trixsyn sirup for arthritis, .1mg Adequan weekly by shot. 75mg Tylan 2x./day for SIBO

Optimmune for Dry eyes

 Kiya is Mickeys sister, 3/4 aussie, 1/4 blue heeler born 9/2006.  She thinks she is a 44 lb jack russell who tries to heel Mickey!!

TJ is the newest addition.  He is in the bottom picture with Kiya.  He was born 7/05/2015. 

I am not a vet, just a pet owner sharing what experiences I have had in helping my dogs with other pet owners.  If you have an emergency please call your vet.




 photo 20160731_182901_zpsl5p1zcbs.jpg



February 23, 2017 at 11:53 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Doc's Mom
Administrator
Posts: 2608
Thanks for posting the map Jill !!
--

MADELON and DOC aka "BUBBY WUBBY"

Nashville, Tennessee

DOB: 4/3/2014 - Diagnosed EPI and SIBO: 5/22/2015
EPI Test Results: 1st test 7/2014 = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate > 24; 
2nd test 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24; 3rd test 10/2015   TLI < .4; B12 >1000; Folate 14.4

Weight: 95 (highest 1/2015) - 76 (lowest 5/2015) - goal met 100lb (7/23/15) - 101.8LBS 12/3/15 - CHUNKY MONKEY

History prior to DX:  May/June 2014 (2mos old) - DX coccidia and bladder infection; July 2014 (3mos old) 1st EPI test = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate >24 - Diagnosed SIBO not EPI; Feb 2015 thru May 2015 - weight loss only; May  2015 vomitted several times, diarrhea and eating poop.

History since DX: has maintained weight between 95-101lbs since July 2015; extreme yeast and rod infection in ears; yeast infection paws (ongoing); bacterial eye infection; bacterial skin infection on legs; poops LIVE fly larvae; diagnosed with mild, focal superficial pyoderma (bacterial infection) - rare lesions on inner thighs; bacterial and yeast overgrowth lip folds; yeast overgrowth feet and left ear; metacarpal/metatarsal draining tracts/fistulae (infection and/or immune mediated disease; probable underlying allergy (food vs. environmental ); staphylococcus pseudintermedius infection in sores on paws; recurring metatarsal fistula - all issues resolved after NutriScan Food Sensitivity Test and switching foods.

NUTRISCAN Food Sensitivity Test (12/2015): reactive to chicken, turkey, white fish, wheat, white potato (mild), venison, soy (mild), pork (mild), duck (mild), corn - switching food based on test resolved all skin issues.

Serum Allergy Test (5/2016): Too many to mention

CURRENTLY :  6 cups Forza10 Legend Skin - Diane 6x 1tsp per cup; 1 WonderLab PetFactor B12 2x day; 2 scoops TotalBiotics 1x day; 600mg vitamin E; 1 Zyrtec 10mg 2x day; Milk Thistle during heartworm/flea/tick meds

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions are based on my personal experiences, information gleaned from EPI research and information from other EPI owners.  Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet

SO THANKfUL FOR OUR EPI4DOGS GUARDIAN ANGELS!!!!!!!!

YOUR PAWS LEFT PRINTS ON MY HEART (in loving memory of Bugsy aka Boo Boo - Boston Terrier 14yrs - not EPI but medically challenging and totally worth it)


February 23, 2017 at 1:41 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Jill
Administrator
Posts: 3499

I think I misspoke:  If I remember right my vet said unless you use the heartworm medicine continuously the maker will not pay for the treatment should your dog test positive.  If your dog does contract heartworm while using their medication continuously they will pay for treatment.  Just got to thinking of this.

--

   Jill-  Washington State

Mickey 6/21/99 - 8/29/2014 

17.5 lb  jack russell, chronic pancreatitis, hyperuricosuria,high blood pressure, hypothyroid, spinal stenosis

diet of  hard boiled eggs, macaroni,  RC Hepatic, mashed potato

2 #2 Dianes enzymes 6x premeal

 2.5 mg Amlodipine, .15mg soloxine am/pm, 100mg ursodiol started for gall bladder thinning

arthritis:  6.25mg tramadol 1x/day, 12.5mg gabapentin every 12 hrs,  Assisi soft loop used on back and elbow, 1- 540meq potassium citrate nightly

Denamarin once a day, 1/16 t tylan (150mg)  2x/day ,  Senilife started 12/14/13, Trixsyn sirup for arthritis, .1mg Adequan weekly by shot. 75mg Tylan 2x./day for SIBO

Optimmune for Dry eyes

 Kiya is Mickeys sister, 3/4 aussie, 1/4 blue heeler born 9/2006.  She thinks she is a 44 lb jack russell who tries to heel Mickey!!

TJ is the newest addition.  He is in the bottom picture with Kiya.  He was born 7/05/2015. 

I am not a vet, just a pet owner sharing what experiences I have had in helping my dogs with other pet owners.  If you have an emergency please call your vet.




 photo 20160731_182901_zpsl5p1zcbs.jpg



February 23, 2017 at 2:46 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16335

Oh WOW!!!  Great Chart. Thanks Jill.


I especially like the mention of using Milk Thistles, as i ALWAYS give Milk Thistles whenever i ahve to give any tick/flea meds or ANY chemical drugs..... so nice to see it supports bu others :)

--

Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

February 24, 2017 at 11:02 AM Flag Quote & Reply

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