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conniej
Member
Posts: 166

I am trying to switch Zoe to raw. Do I need to increase her enzymes? I fed her raw last night and she has soft poop today.

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Zoe is now ten years old. After one year on cooked homemade I am changing her to all raw. She was diagnosed 8.5 years ago and is doing great.

March 14, 2017 at 2:02 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16577

my first response would be to say no.... but if she had loose stools.... give it a couple of days... it just might be something her system has to get used to as raw is totally different from kibble.... however... if after a couple of days, the loose stools continue then yes, i would increase the enzymes by 1/8 tsp... and watch the next day's stools to ascertain if there is any improvement or not... if improvement but not enough, then increase enzymes by another 1/8 tsp.


If no positive response.... then that to me would indicate that some food ingredient in the raw food is not agreeing with Zoe.... in which case... (and this won't hurt "short-term") strip down the menu and start with only 1 ingredient for 3 days.. watch the poo and then add one raw food ingredient at a time ...watching each addition for another 3 days each... and see if you can ascertain which food ingredient is the culprit.

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Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

March 15, 2017 at 12:27 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16577

wierd.... i posted and it is not showing up as having activity.........grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

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Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

March 15, 2017 at 12:32 PM Flag Quote & Reply

conniej
Member
Posts: 166

Should I also start at a smaller serving to start? The recipe for raw I have calls for whole turkey,tripe,guts,veggies and egg. I am doing 3% of her body weight should I try less? I am hoping this will help with her itching and dry skin. Tonight she ate too fast and threw it up.

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Zoe is now ten years old. After one year on cooked homemade I am changing her to all raw. She was diagnosed 8.5 years ago and is doing great.

March 18, 2017 at 5:43 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Donna
Member
Posts: 744

Not all dogs do well on a raw diet... My EPI girl did not. I also tried it on my new rescue (who has a ruined gut from dumpster diving) and she did not do well on it either...

I would consult a nutritionist as they can start with an elimination diet and you can go from there...

Donna

March 18, 2017 at 7:51 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Patsy
Member
Posts: 904

It's difficult experimenting with a new diet. Is the food minced or chunks? Not all  normal dogs can digest raw properly, so Epi enzymes doubles the trouble because you risk upsetting your previous balance. What else have you tried for the skin irritation? 

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Marti  Springer Spaniel, owned by Patsy, Sheffield, England.  She died age 12yrs 6mths  on 27/11/14 from heart failure. Diagnosed after three months, when she was 4 years old,she dropped from 24 kilos to 17 kg.  initially she also had protein losing enteropathy, treated with steroids, ,raw sores on back, obsessive thirst, bursting bowels and biadder, then stable after 2 years.   Developed another autoimmune problem with muscular myositis on head ( muscles wasted away, leaving gaunt hollows.)  She also suffered sometimes from  bottom end thrush, anal  gland infections, and recurrent SIBO treated with 4 weeks of oxytetracycline each time. 

Enzymes: Panzym caused mouth problems, resulting in tooth removal , as I didn't know at the time how caustic it was. I changed to one Lypex  then used VetUk Pancreatic Nutrient tablets, and one Chemeyes because it is half the strength, and I didn't need to use two vet uk ones. Then 3 Chemeyes or  2 pancreatic Nutrient  per meal. 

B12 injection monthly.  Trinfac B12 + intrinsic factor capsules from Chemeyes daily. Metacam for knee joints.  Also used Yumpro Bio pre/probiotics.

Food: picky eater,tinned  Chappie saved her life  till she would eat kibble again.  Eden Holistic, Millies Wolfheart and Lily's Kitchen all good,chicken and grain free.

Vets, one caring learner, who had  nervous breakdown, replaced by obnoxious vet , so I rang round  interviewing them to find someone I trusted and would work with us. Since losing Marti and Bob, I have changed again since the good vet us retired.

RIP Bobby the cocker , from PLN.  Present pet, Tinker the fluffy little grey Greek rescue dog. New addition, Jack ,  a neglected rescue terrier, looks like a fox cub and so happy to to be healthy and loved.

 


March 19, 2017 at 4:48 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16577

good points mentioned.... not all dogs do well on raw.... i should have included that!  Thank goodness Patsy and Donna chimed in.  

One time i was feeding raw chicken to all 3 of my dogs.... Izzy (EPI dog) and Lulu (non-EPI dog) did great, loved it/ no problems... but my poor Rico (A-typical Cushings dog) got sick ... from the same batch of raw chicken!!!... i finally had to take him to the vet and we needed antibiotics to get him straightened out again.  So... as Patsy and Donna suggested... raw does not agree with all dogs.


If you still want to pursue.... maybe start by mixing a little raw in with the previous diet of home-prepared.... and slowly increase the raw and reduce the home-prepared over the course of a few days?  And if this doesn't work, then like i suggested above, some dood ingredient in the raw is most likely not agreeing with Zoe........


I personally don't think i would reduce the amount of food because that might make Zoe even hungrier so the next time and she might try to gulp her food even more so/faster  and then puke once again............. 

--

Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

March 19, 2017 at 9:24 PM Flag Quote & Reply

conniej
Member
Posts: 166

Two months after starting raw Zoe is doing great. She is very happy . I also give her L-glutamine daily which has helped also. She no longer needs B-12 shots weekly either.

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Zoe is now ten years old. After one year on cooked homemade I am changing her to all raw. She was diagnosed 8.5 years ago and is doing great.

May 13, 2017 at 7:01 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16577

AWESOME update Connie!!!!   Some times when we change the diet style it takes a while for the body to get acclimated to it..  

I once asked a vet about L-Glutamine and whether it does or doesn't help....and she said the results using L-Glutamine on dogs was 50-50. Some it really helpd while with others it did not do anything... but worth trying.  Glad to hear that it "sounds" like it is helping.  One thing though about L-Glutamine... be careful giving if your dog also has Diabetes... as it can raise the blood sugar.


Also... the B12. That is wonderful that she does not need the B12 weekly anymore...but just be aware that she will probably still need to be on a B12 regimen, just at a lesser frequency. What we all have learned is if you stop the B12 completely.... in time.... the B12 levels will drop once again...

--

Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

May 14, 2017 at 8:39 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Epi4Dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 16577

Oh... BTW... thank you for recommending that "Raw and Natural" book by Lew Olson... i bought it and it is on my reading list :)

--

Olesia, owned by Izzy, a 35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable 9+ yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes (use EnzymeDiane's 6x) with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Fed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane., gave 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.... until she developed Diabetes and now cannot tolerate higher fat foods.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She is now on an all home-made diet which she does best on and has even been able to reduce the insuline (Vetsulin:pork-based insulin) . Because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia or hyperglycemia- -she is much more even-keeled with a diet of sweet potato, a lean meat/fish, sometimes a free range egg, cottage cheese,  fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions/recommendations are based on personal expereinces, observations, information gleaned from EPI research, and information shared with me by EPI researchers....that hopefully may help others. Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet.

May 14, 2017 at 8:40 AM Flag Quote & Reply

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