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Angel Altamirano
Posts: 2

Brodie my newly diagnosed epi fur baby (2wks) has a very rumble, growlie, loud tummy (last 3 days) in the moring before his am feeding. We are up at 630 am and he eats at 8, 12, 4, and 8. I feed him 8oz dry kibble, 4oz boiled/mashed sweet potatoes and chichen, 4 oz of water and 1.5 tsp enzyme powder per meal.  The rumble tummy stops after he eats.

Should I feed him as soon as he is up?  Should I feed him more? 

February 9, 2018 at 3:54 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Terry Bin
Posts: 2061

Welcome!  How are the poops?  With rumble tummy we often think SID/SIBO but if the poops are good with the current food and enzymes that may not be it.  For amount/frequency of food.  4 times a day is great.  In terms of amount/timing:  it is recommended you feed 150% of the amount recommended for the GOAL weight (not current weight) so I would look at how much you are feeding vs. what the package says.  What time is bedtime?  One option if you go to bed 10pm or later is either move the last feeding to 9pm and see if that helps or add a final very small meal right before bedtime (say 1/2 cup kibble with no extra food, just enzyme and water.  

Can you tell us about your fur baby:  name, breed, age, current weight and goal weight....what brand kibble and enzyme.  What is the B12 level?  



Mom of three EPI Shiloh Shepherds: 

Pharaoh born Nov. 2007 and dx with epi December 2009.   Pharaoh weighed 62.4 lbs. (15 lb. weight loss) when diagnosed in 12/2009.

Weight 10/31/11 was 76.6; 85lbs on 9/22/12; 85.5 lbs. on 11/13/14.

Received six weeks of B12 shots Jan-Feb 2010 but his B12 on 8/10/2010 was only 232. So started weekly shots at home, which we continue to give. 

His older half sister is Taiko born Sept. 2006  and was dx with epi June 2010.  Since she has severe bilateral hip dysplasia she had always been on the thin side.  Taiko's weight was 70.7 lbs. in June 2010 (time of diagnosis; about a 10 lb. weight loss).

Weight on 10/31/11 was 80.4 and on 9/22/12 was 82.4 lbs.  Weight 11/13/14 was 83 lbs.  B12 was 211 in June 2010 so started six weeks of shots and was only 293 on 8/10/10.  She receives B12 shots weekly at home.  B12 in September 2014 was over 1,000.

Both are fed twice a day and we use Merrick BG brand: 1 1/2  cups kibble in the morning with 1/2 can dog food with 4 crushed tablets and in the evening 1 1/2 cups to 2 cups kibble with 1/2 can dog food  with 4 crushed tablets. 

Moku was born 4/15/14 does not have epi.  His grandfather is Taiko's and Pharaoh's father (through his mother).  On 11/05/14 his weight was 78 lbs, on 12/11/14 he was 85.7 and on his first birthday 15 April 2015: 90.2 lbs.

February 10, 2018 at 4:04 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Doc's Mom
Posts: 3150

Hi and welcome to our EPI family.  If you could answer some of Terry's questions it will help us be able to offer suggestions.  My boy's tummy gets rumbly sometimes too - I don't worry unless the poops are off but I'm wondering if your baby is up at 6:30am and waiting to eat until 8am - maybe try feeding at 7am and see if that helps.



Nashville, Tennessee

DOB: 4/3/2014 - Diagnosed EPI and SIBO: 5/22/2015
EPI Test Results: 1st test 7/2014 = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate > 24; 
2nd test 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24; 3rd test 10/2015   TLI < .4; B12 >1000; Folate 14.4

Weight: 95 (highest 1/2015) - 76 (lowest 5/2015) - goal met 100lb (7/23/15) - 101.8LBS 12/3/15 - CHUNKY MONKEY

History prior to DX:  May/June 2014 (2mos old) - DX coccidia and bladder infection; July 2014 (3mos old) 1st EPI test = TLI 16.5, B12 894, Folate >24 - Diagnosed SIBO not EPI; Feb 2015 thru May 2015 - weight loss only; May  2015 vomitted several times, diarrhea and eating poop.

History since DX: has maintained weight between 95-101lbs since July 2015; extreme yeast and rod infection in ears; yeast infection paws (ongoing); bacterial eye infection; bacterial skin infection on legs; poops LIVE fly larvae; diagnosed with mild, focal superficial pyoderma (bacterial infection) - rare lesions on inner thighs; bacterial and yeast overgrowth lip folds; yeast overgrowth feet and left ear; metacarpal/metatarsal draining tracts/fistulae (infection and/or immune mediated disease; probable underlying allergy (food vs. environmental ); staphylococcus pseudintermedius infection in sores on paws; recurring metatarsal fistula - all issues resolved after NutriScan Food Sensitivity Test and switching foods.

NUTRISCAN Food Sensitivity Test (12/2015): reactive to chicken, turkey, white fish, wheat, white potato (mild), venison, soy (mild), pork (mild), duck (mild), corn - switching food based on test resolved all skin issues.

Serum Allergy Test (5/2016): Too many to mention

CURRENTLY :  6 cups Forza10 Legend Skin - Diane 6x 1tsp per cup; 1 WonderLab PetFactor B12 2x day; 2 scoops TotalBiotics 1x day; 600mg vitamin E; 1 Zyrtec 10mg 2x day; Milk Thistle during heartworm/flea/tick meds

I am not a vet.  All of my suggestions are based on my personal experiences, information gleaned from EPI research and information from other EPI owners.  Please always share anything and everything recommended on this forum with your vet


YOUR PAWS LEFT PRINTS ON MY HEART (in loving memory of Bugsy aka Boo Boo - Boston Terrier 14yrs - not EPI but medically challenging and totally worth it)

February 10, 2018 at 5:35 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Jean and Kara
Posts: 7462
Welcome from the uk i will email you to say you have some responses





From Liverpool England

born 21st July 2009

Adopted at five months old 26th December 2009


EPI dx August 2010

tli<1.00 folate 8.3 cobalimin 611

Antibiotics  2 Oxytet antibiotics 3 times a day also if we cannot fit the Oxytet in she has Tylan 1/8th teaspoon before her meals as a maintenanance dose

Food- Ashenbank Lamb Casserole  twice daily equalling 3 cups per day possibly more

Zantac (ranitadine) 75 mg 30 minutes before each meal as too much acid was being produced, causing shedding of bowel lining

Enzymes-Panzym 3 gram per meal twice daily ( 3/4 teaspoon ) 

B12 injection once every three weeks

One Chemeyes B12 with intrinsic factor of 40 daily

One Antepsin before bedtime

Allergies to beef, pork, chicken. and white fish confirmed by blood test

33.6 kilos in weight as of 5th May 2013

37 kilos as of 10th June 2014

40.65 kilos, 89.6 pounds as of 3rd March 2015

Vet says she is now processing her food correctly

Very proud of all of us



I am not a vet, nor have veterinary experience, but have lived and breathed EPI for 51/2 years, and hope I can bring some support to others, as others have to me.


February 13, 2018 at 10:57 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Angel Altamirano
Posts: 2

Thank you for your time and input. 

My boy's name is Brodie.  He is a Queensland/Border Collie mix. He is about 4 yrs old approximately (we rescued him).  After a year of multiple vet visits, changeing vets, multi foods........a long year of what finally got us to a TLI <1.2 test and a confirmed EPI diagnosis.His weight as of Jan. 22, 2018 was 29lbs4oz. with poop charted at a 6........now after adding the enzyme 6x, B-12 inj., probiotic, and multi- vit. He is recoving rapidly. Last weight in Feb. 2 he's up to 35lbs, poop charting at a 3. his current kibble is Blue Buffalo limited ingredient/grain-free turkey and potato. 

I upped his last pm feeding and that seams to have helped with the rummble tummy. 


February 18, 2018 at 7:25 PM Flag Quote & Reply

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