EPI * Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency

Like most here I have been round and round.  I have a 2 1/2 year old female Boxer Maggie.  I have been struggling for a diagnosis for her and had just thought this is the way she is going to be.  After visit upon visit to the vet's office I was told she had a high metabolism, she was very entergetic and high maintinence.  Stressed beyond all control I have done some research and I am having Maggie's TLI done today.  Reading the posts in the forum and on the EPI webpage has given me a renewed hope and an answer to my prayers!!  Thank you!!

Hello Cheryl,

I am new to dealing with EPI myself.  When my 2 year old German Shepherd was younger and I was concerned about his lack of weight gain, I also heard how it was probably just his high energy.  This past December when he started to lose weight and his coat became poor, my concerns were finally addressed and I think we are on the right path back to good health.  All the wonderful knowledge here has helped put us on that path.  I wish you good luck in finding some answers for your girl!

Becky

Hi Cheryl and welcome, although sorry you need to be here.  Glad to hear you are being proactive in your pup's well being and are taking the first step in doing the cTLI test. Just be sure the dog is fasted for 12 hours prior to the blood draw.  Also, while I'm not sure where you live, it you are having the blood sent off to TAMU, you might want to wait until Monday as it will most likely take a day to get there and the lab is closed on the weekend. Additionally, you might want to ask your vet about having the B12 checked at the same time...It will save you $$ as you will not have to do an additional draw and send it out at another time.

Good luck and let us know!

Becky it has been a constant struggle trying to get the Vets here to listen to me, one even told me I was an over protective Mom.  After this weekends episode it was quite obvious that there was something other than "high metabolism" going on. 

I would like to say that I had done a little more research on my breed and what not and had decided after some bouts with bad gas (really BAD) that I was going to switch to a RAW diet, however my vet was REALLY not a fan and did everything in his power to always blame the diet for her weight and stools.  Finally he had worn me down and I switch back to a kibble but refused to feed her anything with grain.  The problems continued to persist and I switched Vets. But I still could not get anything other than it was her metabolism.    Fast forward to this weekend where armed with research I was not going to take "no" for an answer.  I insisted that they test her for cTLI. So fingers toes and everything else crossed.....I will finally know. 

Hi Donna thank you for the welcome and while I really didn't want to end up here, I am so very grateful to have such a support system.  We did fast her for 13 1/2 hours which killed me.  But I know that is best for her. And yes they are going to be running the B-12 as well.  I believe they are shipping it overnight and I paid extra for that .  So I am praying this is where we start our treatment to a much healthier girl......after much of the research and looking back at our past I do believe that I am going to be putting her back on the raw diet, adding the enzymes, and working to find what works best for her.   As soon as I get the results I will post and of course look to some help about implementing my plan.  Thank you again for the welcome and the advise.

Hi Cheryl & Maggie,  Welcome.

You are doing a great job with Maggie & by getting the cTLI test & B12 levels tested, you will know exactly what you're dealing with.  There are lots of wonderful, very knowledgeable people here that will help you every step of the way. 

Maggie certainly is a cutie.  Please feel free to post more pics. of her here.  We all love to see photo's.

Lynn & girls.

Cheryl,

I have heard that many vets are not supportive of RAW diets.  I feel a well balanced RAW diet can be great for many dogs.  We feed our 1 year old german shepherd, Scout, a premade ground RAW.  Our 2 year old german shepherd, Boss, who has the malnutrition problem, has never taken a liking to it so has been on grain free kibble.  When you get the test results back you should hopefully finally get some answers and can try to find the right diet that works for your girl.  Finding out a dog has EPI is not a good thing but sometimes it is just such a relief to find out the problem so you can start working on the solution.  So far we are extremely pleased with the progress we are making at getting Boss stable.  Sure beats the frustration and worry we had been dealing with all Fall with his lack of appetite and weight loss. 

Becky

Hi Cheryl,

WOW... you are already taking all the right steps.... so, if you do indeed need to be here,.  I just want to extend a warm welcome to you and let you know that we will help support you in every way that we can!

Welcome Cheryl and Maggie,    

You have come to the right place.   All here will do everything we can to help you. 

YOU ARE NOT ALONE IN THIS,

Cheryl:

Welcome to the forum, I'm awfully glad that you found us.  Olesia has done an amazing job of putting together information and we have some very caring people here to are always ready to help, even if it's nothing more than just offering support.  Maybe I should be saying..."welcome home" because quite frankly after going through a scary period of time with these sweet babies, and feeling fear and frustration, that must be almost what it feels like to finally find somewhere where people understand and have lived with what you are now going through.  Overprotective mom indeed!!!  You're on the right track and we'll all be here for you.

I wanted to mention something that maybe has already been addressed.  Trust your judgement on what is best to feed Maggie.  There are some wonderful kibbles out on the market now, that are either grain free or others that have only grains that many dogs can tolerate.  Each dog is very individual and what will work best for one dog, may not for another.  If you truly want to raw feed, then give it a try.  Just make sure that it's a well balanced diet and in the case of raw fed dogs with EPI, they can't seem to handle quite as much bone.  Some people here feed kibble some meals and raw others and I believe that there may be a person or two who mix.  We all just want to do what is best for our dogs.  As I said...trust your judgement and if one thing doesn't work, you have many alternatives and several people who will jump in with suggestions. 

Keep us posted...      

Thank you everyone for the warm welcome and kind words.  I am so grateful for all the advice.  Reading everyone's experiences has been a hugh help and has given me a good idea of where to go next in my  journey. 

Hi Cheryl ~  Would love to see some pictures of Maggie (hint-hint).... Boxers have such sweet temperaments... i bet you have a lot of great photo's of her!

Good morning Olesia, I seem to be having a small problem with posting photo's I will work on it and see if I can get it fixed

Well got it all figured out and here she is......she is the most photogentic dog I have ever seen......Maggie Mae poses everytime there is a camera out!! 

This is Maggie (in the back) and Herbie cuddling up.  They are litter mates and a huge hand full.  As you can tell Maggie is worlds smaller than Herbie. 

These are my 3 musketeers.......Maggie in front, Abby my skin baby.......and of course Herbie.......laying the the window catching some warmth from the sun. 

Our day at the park!! 

Cheryl,

I just love the photos of Maggie!!!  She is such a sweetie!!

Thank you Donna......

Well I promised an update as soon as the Vet called....so here it goes......He has diagnoesd Maggie not with EPI but with pancreatitis and kidney disease.  Right now I just trying to wrap my head around this and where to go from here.

I will keep you all posted. 

Cheryl,

I'm sorry to hear this, but at least you know....Chronic pancreatitis can eventually lead to EPI as well...What is the kidney disease?? IS she in renal failure or does she have some type of deformity?  Again, I'm so very sorry, but there is hope!  I also belong to a yahoo group called K9 kitchen and I have to tell you that diets can do wonders for these dogs!!! Both EPI and Pancreatitis require a low fat diet.

Thanks Donna I am going to be checking out the K9 Kitchen later this evening!!  With both it's seems to be a double edge sword, the pancreas needs the extra protein and the kidneys need low protein.....but I am bound and determined to figured this out. 

I did have the Vet fax over the test results and here is what it has:

protein 2+

Mircoalbuminuria 28.2                        Normal <2.5

BUN 58                                                   Normal 6-31

Creatinine 2.9                                        Normal 0.5-1.6

Na/K ratio 40                                          Normal 27-38

Amylase 3552                                        Normal 290-1125

Lipase 3106                                           Normal 77-695

cTLI >50                                                   Normal 5-35

SPEC cPL   798                                     Normal < or 200

The cTLI states that the results are consistent with 1) Acute Pancreatitis

                                                                                             2) Renal dysfunction

                                                                                             3) Severe Malnutrition

.....he cannot pinpoint the kidney dysfunction until we run some other tests.....so Monday morning we are going to go and do an ultrasound on the abdominal cavity to check both the pancreas and the kidneys, run some more blood and a urine culture........I am thinking about now I am going to have to work on the diet to keep both under control as best I can.  Thanks again and I will keep you posted