EPI * Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency

My 4 1/2 yr. old EPI girl Hope is battling SIBO for the first time.  We are on vacation so I found a vet in Helena, Montana, who researched EPI  as he had not treated any other EPI dogs, ran a cobalamin, folate test since I had fasted Hope, and diagnosed SIBO.  He started her on metronidazole until I could obtain Tylan which I now have.

Hope will not take the Tylan no matter how I try to hide it in something.  My question is this - can I dissolve the Tylan in a teaspoon of warm water and give it to her in a dosing syringe by squirting it on the back of her tongue?  I used to dose horses this way - can I do so with a dog?  I posted this question to the global group, but for some reason I can not access my Yahoo account so I can't read any replies I got.

Also, the vet prescribed 1/4 teas.3x daily.  Hope weighs about 63 lbs.  Does this sound like the correct dose?  The vet said he thought this was right based on what he had read but he said he has never before prescribed Tylan.  He did know that the Tylan had to be for at least 6 weeks, and he referenced TAMU so he really did his homework.  (Anyone who would like his name please contact me off list.)

 I remember reading that you could put the Tylan in capsules, but I don't have capsules here.  I asked at a local pharmacy and the pharmacy tech said they didn't carry them - she thought I could just pour the powder down Hope's throat - what was she thinking????

Thanks for any help anyone can give me - Hope and I really appreciate it.

Pam and Hope

Pam, We give Tylan loaded in capsules I pick up at a vitamin/health food store. I first looked at a pharmacy also and, like you, was told they did not have any. So you may want to try a health food store. I know some folk have had luck with hiding it in cream cheese pockets but it is bitter and very airborne so you have to be careful tucking it into anything. Not sure about mixing it in water... Sorry. Our GSD had dropped to 64 pounds when first started on Tylan and our vet had us at 1/2 tsp twice a day but others here have posted that they use 1/4 tsp twice a day for that weight range so you are in the middle with your vet dosage. From what I have been told, Tylan is a very mild antibiotic, maybe accounting for the difference in dosing. If you cannot get the Tylan down her and she responded well to the Metro you could continue to use that, as others have had good luck with it clearing up SIBO also... Not so with us, but it just depends on the dog. Good luck with Hope and enjoy Montana - I have heard it is beautiful country.

Hi Pam,    It sounds like you have gotten some very good advice from Becky.   All I can add to this is that if you need capsules, you can always buy some simple vitamins in capsules and then empty them out and refill them will the tylan.   Kinda of a pain in the #@*, but  they will work in a pinch.    I have done this myself. 

Sorry this set back has complicate your vacation, maybe you can get Hope on the right track quickly with the help of this vet, who does seem to be trying very hard.   You are lucky to find a vet so willing to research and help you out.

Good luck and have some fun

Hello Pam,

We started our Lulu on Tylan a few weeks ago after unsuccessfully running two courses of Metro and the Tylan seems to be doing the trick. Tylan apparently is very bitter and as a fine powder is tricky to handle or hide.

We encapsulate the Tylan using a cheap but effective capsule machine, in our case the aptly named 'https://www.capsuleconnection.com/" target="_blank">The Capsule Machine' which you can get from the manufacturer who also sell the capsules. We got ours on Ebay but I believe health food/vitamin retailers also stock similar machines and empty gelatin or vege based capsules as do our local pharmacy.

Lulu is also on 1/4 tsp twice daily which neatly equates to the long end of a size '00' capsule (make sure you get the right size - '00' is bigger than '0' and you'll need '00'). We then slip the capsule into some cream cheese but then Lulu loves her cheese. It's quick, easy, no mess and you get to cut drugs on your kitchen table every couple of weeks which is always fun.

Craig

Hi Pam.  There were a few responses on the global site.  Maybe when you can get back in, you will see other thoughts also.  I don't see a problem w/ using the water in a syringe method.  It's worth a try.

When Hondo was in the 60's,  we did 1/4 tsp 2X day.  When he hit 90 we upped it.  So yes, what your vet said is in the ball park.  Good luck and hope you enjoy the rest of your vacation.

HI Pam,

I would use the syringe as a last option...If you shoot too far it can go in the lungs and cause an aspiration pneumonia. As others have said, you can buy capules at a health food store or order them online.  There is a place called "Capsuline" that I've used in the past.

What a fantastic vet to go that extra mile!!!   Good luck! 

Hi Pam - Jackie is 100 lbs and we used 1/4 tsp 2 times daily.  I would mix it with her food (with the enzymes) and let it sit for 1/2 hr.   Everything was mixed with probably 1/4 (maybe slight bit more) room temp water.    I am one of the lucky ones who didn't have problems with Jackie eating but I know a lot of pups do and hopefully others can give u recommendations on what u might add to their food to entice a bit.  Hope u find what works lady...best wishes.   

Re: the dosing, it all depends on the milligram (mg) strength. What the vet prescribes may seem differrent from what the pharm gives you, as the pharm will dispense whatever strength they have and adjust the quantity to fit the vet's scripted dose. Human meds are often considerably higher or lower mg per kg than what we'd use on pets, so pharmacies often don't have the right dose available and have to adjust. Our dog took 250mg 3xdaily (she was 45lbs at the time).

On our end, capsules were not available either but the pharmacy has compounding services, which makes them up into capsules. It takes some time (our pharmacist requires minimum of 2-3 days). This may be why they didn't offer to compound. You may want to check back with them. Definitely worth the extra expense and time. Good luck!

HI Pam ~

Everyone has given you spot on advice/suggestions so i won't add to that... BUT... i do want to say that Tyaln gets airborne very easily.

What i have learned to do (i tuck mine in cream cheese) is that i have to get everything ready first.. open the bottle with the tylan away from where i have the cream cheese pockets set up... i pour the Tylan into the cream chees and then wash my hands before i touch the cream cheese again and pinch it together.... and i wash my hand yet again before i give the cream cheese pocket to my Izzy..... Tylan (although great) tends to get on everything and it has a nasty, NASTY bitter taste!

:DI am new to SIBO but I work for an ag supply company and we sell this stuff all the time to farmers!  Thought you would like to know what one of the guys told me about how bad the taste is... he said they use it for baby pigs and they mix in the water but it is so awful tasting the piglets won't drink the water so they actually mixed koolaid in the water to get the pigs to drink it with the tylan in it!  So if pigs won't drink it I'm not sure any dog will.

Hi Annie's mom...

yep it's real nasty tasting...you don't even ahve to touch it but it gets on your hands... the only way my gal will take it is if i constantly wash my hands while handling it so that however i "package" it...it is not "contaminated... ahh so much fun!!!

okay...so I got the odd dog (no surprises there).  Charlie Pete will happilly take it squirted into his mouth with a syringe.  Okay..maybe not happily but doesnt argue as long as it is followed by a treat.

Well give Charlie Pete a bone!  Can't believe he tolerates it!  Tough cookie he is. 

Charlie-Pete IS indeed special... he really takes that nasty Tylan without turning his head away from you??? WOW... I'm impressed!!

Pam ~

I actually also just tried what becky recommended: Tylan loaded in capsules... and this works great... but again.,... i had to handle the capsules with "washed & clean" hands... My Izzy HATES tylan and any little Tylan residue on anything ... and she'll refuse to take it......

I purchased chicken flavor gelatin capsules.   I haven't had the guts to give without a pill pocket wrapped around it though.  The first night I gave her tylan I washed my hands but had some underneath a nail... licked my finger and about DIED.  That is some nasty stuff.

Funny, but Suzie is like Charlie-Pete.   When I have had to use it, I simply add it to her food mixture, and she eats it like it isnt even there.   Go figure.   This is the dog that took 8 months to stabilize, and ran me thru every food combination there is.  She only at one kind of food for 2 days and then nothing.  

Now, Tylan..........no problem.    What the heck, Suzie?

Brenda...LOL...Jackie was the same way - 6 foods later and she has no issue with the Tylan - we were one of the "lucky" ones...

Annie's mom - no infections this week for you! :-)

Brenda...LOL...Jackie was the same way - 6 foods later and she has no issue with the Tylan - we were one of the "lucky" ones...

Annie's mom - no infections this week for you! :-)