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Forum Home > General Discussion > Buttercup--Recently diagnosed with EPI

jebel321
Member
Posts: 30

Hi,

I am Jessica, mom to Buttercup, a hound mix. We won't go into all the details of how Buttercup was diagnosed (long process as I am sure it is for most), but it was confirmed with a blood test in November that Buttercup does in fact have EPI. I don't have actual numbers from the tests but can get them if needed. Due to some circumstances out of our control, Buttercup was staying with my in laws for about the last month. She has been taking Pancrezyme tablets, but they appear to be ineffective. Now that Buttercup is back home with us, I plan to purchase enzyme powder to see if that's more effective. I am going to crush her enzyme tablets while we are waiting on the new enzymes. I would ask if anyone has any recommendations for our first powder, but since it appears that every dog responds differently to different enzymes, there is no real one brand to start with. I guess I will go with whatever the vet recommends, although I can tell the vet might know about as much as I do at this point with my own research. I don't mean that disrespectfully...it's just that I can tell this isn't something that appears to be well known by a lot of vets.

So, in the coming days, I plan to try to get some powdered enzymes, some food that fits the EPI guidelines, talk to the vet about antibiotics for SIBO, purchase some B12 to give her (she had one shot last month...the vet had said she'd need them monthly, but it looks like she might need it more frequently according to this site) and then I guess go from there. I am incredibly overwhelmed by all of this--that Buttercup looks as terrible as she does, the level of financial commitment this is going to require, and the fact that this is a guessing game of sorts to fix her. I am afraid I am not going to get this figured out and she won't make it. I am grateful that this site exists, and I intend to continue reading and educate myself. So far, these are the questions I have:

  • While I am crushing the tablets, do I need to let them incubate like I would a powder?
  • There really are no first "go to" enzymes or food brands, right?
  • When I get her on an appropriate EPI food and new enzymes, how many days until I will notice firmer stools if that is in fact going to happen? (Because that's really the only way to tell if things are helping/working, other than weight gain, right?)
  • In a "normal" dog, changing food formulas/brands can cause digestive upset. Is this even more the case with an EPI dog? If I am switching foods, do I need to be mixing the old with the new to transition her or is it okay to just go to the new food?
  • Things like flea and heartworm medication have been given orally before...can you treat an EPI dog with oral medications, or do I need to stick to things like topical and injections because she can't properly digest these medications now for them to be effective? Or will they still work fine as long as they are given to her with enzymes/food?
  • From what I read, it sounds like I am going to HAVE to give her antibiotics for SIBO. Do I need to wait a little while for that since I also intend to change her food and enzymes within the next week or is it imperative to get her on antibiotics now? Are there really any probiotics recommended by folks to go along with these antibiotics?

I would like to thank anyone in advance who is able to respond to my questions. I appreciate it. I hope everyone had a Merry Christmas!

Sincerely,
Jessica


December 26, 2012 at 3:33 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Buttermom
Member
Posts: 1237

Good morning Jessica......  Take a deep breath, it'll help.  I am not familiar with the usage of the tablets, so we'll let another member advise you on that, but as far as the powdered enzymes go, there is a member who is a lovely angel and sells enzymes at quite a reduced cost.  You can find Diane's information and web site under the enzyme tab above.  They are the same enzymes as the doctor might prescribe to you under Viokase, so that's something to consider as far as keeping costs down.  As far as the food options......  The brands mentioned under the food tab are ones that members have had success with, but since each dog is different, well......  Don't be concerned with changing the food right away, getting Buttercup on a good food with the enzymes is the most important thing.  Once you get the enzyme ratio right, it will be a pretty gosh-darn quick turn around in the poop department.  The general rule of thumb is a 1:1 ratio of enzymes to food.  1 tsp to 1 cup.  It's very important that you keep a journal in the beginning so you can monitor any changes that occur.  Once you get started, make one change at a time  and wait a few days to see if there is a difference......the journal helps keep your sanity, believe me.  Oral medications are still effective and do not need to be incubated, and as far as the SIBO goes, most pups with epi have it in the beginning....  Olesia will have the percentages....  and yes, you  must treat with antibiotics for at least 30 days......  My question is, when the test was done, did you get the B12 level?  Almost certainly Buttercup will need supplementation of B12, either thru shots or pills or both. 

Again, breathe......  Yes it seems overwhelming at first, but you have come to the right spot for help.....  These folks are awesome.....  

Ask any questions you have.....

Susan

--

"I am I because my little dog knows me."   Gertrude Stein

Butterbean, Chihuahua born on 06-27-2004, diagnosed in May-June of 2010 via pancreatic biopsy. TLI score of 0.7. Feeding Darwins duck, 1.2 ounces twice daily with 1/4 tsp of enzyme. In the am she also gets 1/4 tsp of Platiinum Performance Canine CJ as well as 1/8 tsp of slippery elm powder.  She gets a B12 shot every 10 days, and a Wonderlab's capsule every 3 days.

December 26, 2012 at 4:00 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Jean and Kara
Member
Posts: 5747

hello and welcome from UK

 

i hope you are not involved with the weather we seem to be having recently

 

not much to add except to keep a record of everything you do in a large notebook and my advice would be to visit Enzyme Dianes website

 

  http://www.enzymediane.com/

 

she is one of our members and will give advice by phone if you call her

 

we usually advise to work out what weight the dog should be and add 50% more over the day divided into as many meals as you can fit in all with enzymes

 

the protocol for GENERIC b12 is one a week for several weeks and then less frequently not once a month at the start

 

we suggeat low fibre less than 5% and grain free the US guys will jump in on brands

 

good luck

 

 

jeanx

 

can you get all of the results from your vet?????

--

 

 

Kara

 

From Liverpool England


born 21st July 2009


adopted at five months old 26th December 2009

 

EPI dx August 2010


tli<1.00 folate 8.3 cobalimin 611

Antibiotics  2 Oxytet antibiotics 3 times a day also if we cannot fit the Oxytet in she has Tylan 1/8th teaspoon before her meals as a maintenanance dose

Food- Ashenbank Lamb Casserole  twice daily equalling 3 cups per day possibly more

Zantac (ranitadine) 75 mg 30 minutes before each meal as too much acid was being produced, causing shedding of bowel lining

enzymes-Panzym 1 gram per meal twice daily ( 1/4 teaspoon )  plus one Lypex

B12 injection once every three weeks

one Chemeyes B12 with intrinsic factor of 40 daily

one Antepsin before bedtime

alergies to beef pork chicken and white fish confirmed by blood test

33.6 kilos in weight as of 5th May 2013

39 kilos as of 10th June 2014

 

"UNCONDITIONAL LOVE WAS INVENTED BY DOGS"

 

 


December 26, 2012 at 4:31 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Tracey, Sofie's mom
Member
Posts: 1662

Hi Jessica and welcome to you and Buttercup (how sweet:)

 

It can be very overwhelming in the beginning...and for most of us cost is a concern. Once you have a diagnosis the costs are pretty manageable. I live in Canada and get enzymes from Diane at 1/3 the cost - Diane had her own EPI dog so you know she has a vested interest in her product.

B12 and Tylan can be ordered online at much reduced costs as well. I think we figured out recently that a larger dog with EPI cost about $30-$40 dollars a month over and above food once stabilized..

 

B12 is very important and will most likely be ongoing - it affects appetite, coat, mood, energy level, weight gain, etc. EPI dogs need a high "normal" of 600+ to really prosper.

 

Tylan is the recommended antibiotic - can get it online from Amazon or other such places. It is very bitter - some put it right on food, Sofie won't eat it so I buy gel caps and pill her.

 

Not sure what you are feeding Buttercup now? Grain free, low fiber (less than 4%) food is recommended although as you will see what works for one EPI dog might not work for another. You have to address all 4 things - food, B12, enzymes and antibiotics - but each dog requires tweaking to suit their own needs. Many EPI dogs seem to have issues with cooked chicken products. I had tweaked lots of things with Sofie, food was the last. I think that was key for her due to an issue with chicken.

 

I can't comment on the pills but if you get powdered enzymes from Diane it is usually recommended to start with 1 teaspoon of enzymes per 1 cup of kibble. A bit less (1/2-3/4 tsp) for raw or wet food. Add a bit of room temperature water to moisten food for better enzyme coverage, mix, let incubate for at least 20 minutes to help prevent mouth sores, mix again and serve.

 

Once you get these things addressed you should see a pretty amazing turnaround in the poops:) I would recommend waiting to add probiotics for now - we try to keep things simple in the beginning so it is easier to know what is helping / not.

 

The lack of vet knowledge is very common - we just try to use this opportunity to educate the vets that welcome it. Point your vet to this site - it is highly recommended by the veterinary community who specialize in EPI! Then hopefully the next dog that goes to your vet for help won't have to wait so long for a diagnosis:)

 

Please keep us posted - and yes, go ahead and breathe, it's allowed....

--

Tracey, Sofie's mom

Sofie, Shiloh shepherd, born March 2010; diagnosed April 2011. Currently eats 3.5 cups of TOTW Lamb per day plus a bit of cooked beef, pork, tripe or liver, etc. with 1 tsp. of 8x enzymes per cup. 1 Wonderlabs B12 pill per day, 1 tbsp coconut oil 2x a day and currently back on Tylan 2x a day. Her lowest weight was 66 lbs, she is now a lovely 85 lbs.

December 26, 2012 at 9:24 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Michele
Administrator
Posts: 6131

Hi Jessica - just want to welcome you and sweet Buttercup to the forum - you have gotten great advice above.   In an effort to curb costs you might want to see if you can give the B12 shots yourself or even try using B12 with intrinsic http://www.wonderlabs.com/itemleft.php?itemnum=6881#factbox


In the beginning it does feel very overwhelming - just know we are here to help you, to hold your hand and sometimes to make you even smile  :)

--

Michele

http://gardensoftranquility.com/



Jackie - Diagnosed at 9 mos (09/09) - TLI 0.3 and low end of B12.  Pancreatin 8x dosing 3/4tsp per cup.   TOTW High Prarie, Trinfac-B Intrinsic Factor daily, probiotics and Duralactin in the am. Mega-E:  cisapride and metoclopramide.    Stable and happy 122lbs - thanks to all the beautiful souls on this forum, we could not have done it without YOU.

Dexter - Diagnosed 11/10 approx 3 yrs of age.   We failed fostering and now he has his forever home :)   At initial testing - TLI 1.2 (range 5-35) B12 254 (range 249-733) folate 20.2 (range 6.5-11.5)   TOTW High Prarie, Pancreatin 8x dosing is 3/4 tsp per cup, Trinfac-B Intrinsic Factor daily, probiotics with each meal and glucosamine chondroitin in the am.  Hypothyroidism:   Soloxine.    Stable and happy 97 lbs.


December 26, 2012 at 9:37 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Paula
Member
Posts: 2634

HI, Jessica. Welcome to you and lovely Buttercup! So glad you found us! It looks like most of your questions have been answered, so I'll just offer that on the tablets, the recommended starting point is 1 tablet per cup of kibble, plus one "for the bowl". So two cups of kibble would use 3 tablets, as a starting point. And yes, crush them, add warm water (bath water temp) and the kibble and incubate for 20+ minutes.  I also recommend Diane's product (www.enzymediane.com). 1/3 the cost of what you get from the vet - just the generic version. Managing EPI requires the balance of 4 things: 1) the correct food for Buttercup - low fiber (<4%), usually grain-free; 2) porcine enzymes (you are on the right track there); 3) B12 supplementation if needed. If Buttercups B12 levels are low or low-ish,  you will need to get them up to get her truly healthy. The recommended protocol from Texas A&M utiizes injections of generic B12 subcutaneously 1x/week for 6 weeks (See the B12 tab for more detail); 4) antibiotics for SIBO if needed. SIBO is generally diagnosed by clinical signs - gurgly belly, yellow tinge to the stool, gas, etc. Treatment requires 30-45 days on antibiotics (Tylosin/tylan is the drug of choice). Once you get all four of these things in place, you've provided the optimal environment for Buttercup to get well. If you haven't already, you might want to take a look at the tab "EPI in Snapshots", a powerpoint presentation we put together for people just starting out - when there is way too much information to absorb at a time when you are already reeling from the diagnosis.

--

Paula and Maya (bday 12/21/06) (diagnosed 10/26/10 TLI 1.5, B12 659 (ref:249-733), weight 52 lbs. After 30 days, retested B12/folate - B12 plummeted to 200, which greatly affected her personality. After following B12 protocol, currently giving semi-weekly B12 shots at home, plus daily WonderLabs Trinfac. Weight in July 2013: 75 lbs - the picture of health


December 26, 2012 at 10:21 AM Flag Quote & Reply

shirl
Member
Posts: 2162

Hello Jessica and Buttercup...welcome to the forum!  As far as switching to a new food, most dogs don't seem to have a problem switching cold turkey to a grain-free food.  But if you are concerned, you can always switch gradually.  We've had people on the forum who have done both, it's really very individual for each dog and there's no way to know for sure until you try it.  As for the enzymes, I gor Viokase V powder from my vet for my first batch of enzymes.  After that, I tried Diane's Pancreatin 6x.  It worked exactly the same as the Viokase V, and it cost 1/3rd of what the vet charged.  I absolutely recommend Diane's product, and the only real difference between the 6x and the 8x is the strength, so you use less of the 8x.  If you have any questions, you can contact Diane and she'll help you out any way she can. 

 

Good luck, ask any other questions that come up, and keep us posted on your journey!

--

Mom to Pixie, 8 year old sheltie,inherited from my mother-in-law 3/11.  Dx of EPI 9/09.  TLI in 10/09 was 0.4 ug/L.  As of 12/2/11, Folate fasting levels was 13.6 ug/L, and Cobalamin fasting was 615.   Current weight 20.9 lbs (7/13), solid member of the Chunky Monkey Club!  Ideal weight around 17, I think, but she's not obese at this weight, so maybe 17 is a little low.  Feeding grain free - Merrick 96% Pork canned and Nature's Variety Instinct Limited Ingredient Lamb kibble.  Giving slightly less than 1/2 tsp Pancreatin 8X per 1/2 cup of food.  Tylan 1x/day maintenance dose.  Also takes 1/2 tablet pepcid for stomach upset 2x/day.   Getting bi-weekly B-12 shots.  Our little pack also includes my husband, our 13 year old sheltie, Lucy, and our 10 year old sheltie, Einstein. 

December 26, 2012 at 10:55 AM Flag Quote & Reply

jebel321
Member
Posts: 30

Thanks, everyone! I appreciate you all taking the time to respond. I have emailed Diane and will purchase enzymes from her this week. Since I can order Tylan online, looks like I will get that ordered as well. I plan to get the B12 from the vet. I am waiting on them to fax me Buttercup's blood work results.

The one thing I am still unsure about...is it okay to give Buttercup her chewable Heartgard for heartworm preventative and Comfortis for flea control or do I need to try alternative methods for both?

Thanks!

Jessica

--

Buttercup diagnosed with EPI in November 2012.

Currently on 2 1/2 cups a day (1 1/2 cups AM/1 cup in PM) of Nutro Grain Free Venison & Potato (12% fat & 3% fiber)

1 1/2  tsp. 6x enzymes per meal incubated for 20 minutes

B12 pill daily

December 26, 2012 at 11:52 AM Flag Quote & Reply

epi4dogs
Site Owner
Posts: 13301

Hi Jessica and a very warm welcome to you and Buttercup...... take a deep breathe....it will be okay AND it will be very affordable.....  because that is what we are here for.....this little epi community will help you navigate this step by step ;).

1. No worries that your vet is not overly familiar with EPI.... many vets aren't.... just have your vet check out this site... please explain that what we tend to recommend is all backed up by recent veterianian EPI research.... so.... pleas share everything we tell you with your vet AND if your vet is welling to learn more indepth information about EPI with you.... well.... what we have discovered is that those vets turn out to be the best stewards of EPI patients ;).


2. Crush the pills you have now to get you thru... but might want to consider ordering generic porcine pancreatin powder 6x from EnzymeDiane... i too started on Pancrezyme..and the 6x from DIane is the same. We ahve been using the 6x for 6 years now.... and my dog has been stable ever since... AND i save a ton of money. WHe n on the Pancrezyme... it was going to cots me $1200/annually just for the enzymes... when i switched to EnzymeDiane's generic 6x my cost dropped to $400 a year, after my gal became stable (delivered consistently normal poops 1-3 times a day for 2-3 months) then i started playing around with the dose of enymzes to see how little her body now needed.... and that dropped to half a teaspoon... so... my cost dropped further to only $200/annually for enzymes.  Big saving's eh?!


3. Everyone has given you spot on suggestions about the B12.... 82% of all EPI dogs have a B12 problem.... check out the B12 page and share with your vet.... Buttercup "probably" needs to be placed on the B12 regimen to bring her levels up... then once there..... all you and your vet have to figure out is what/how much B12 she will then need to simply maintain her B12 levels at the upper mid range (600ish)... any other level, even if in the normal B12 range is not sufficient for an EPI dog.


4. SIBO...or SID as they are now calling it....happens in 100% of EPI dogs when first diagnosed.... just because of the very nature of untreated EPI..... the wishful thinking scenario (please share this with your vet) is that sometimes once you start giving the enzymes...sometimes it is enough to rebalance in imbalance of the bad gut flora going on.... if this happens...YIPPEEE!!!!! ........but.......if within a week (or two at the very most) you do not see an improvement in the stools.... if you hear any tummy gurgling, smell stinky gas, poos stink really bad, see slime in the poo or lots of yellow tinge to the poo that is not going away.... any of these signs = the enzymes did not address the bad gut flora going on.... so then you need to adminsiter antibiotics.  The drug of choice (have your vet read the SIBO page) is now Tylan, twice a day for 30-45 days... 45 being preferred.  The old drug of choice was the Metronidazole and that is twice a day for 30 days. If the SIBO returns and never is completely addressed by either of these two antibioticregimens ... then you add the pre/probiotic to the regimen....


5. Diet..... start with food that has 4% or less fiber content in it..... check out the Dog Food Options page here.... these are foods that have worked well with many EPI dogs.... of course there are no guarantees..... as mentioned above, what worked for one may or may not work for another.... what we suggest is to buy a small bag of food to try to see if it will agree with Buttercup.... read the DIET page... if will explain how to prepare the food and the "why's" of things going on....  to the best of our knowledge..........just a FYI.. i switched over 100% with the food from food with grain to food without grain.... and had no issues....it is if you go the opposite way from no grain or raw food and go to food with grain


We will help you learn how to prepare the Tylan (it is a wonderful bacteriostatic anti that is very mild but very effective.. there seems to be much more success with Tylan than other drugs.......) but it is also very bitter tasting powder.... some dogs are okay with it... others will refuse food with it.... so we will help you get around this also, if needed.


But for now..... share what we are telling you with your vet, keep an EPI LOG (you can download a template of one from the download page) implement what we suggested so far about the enzymes, diet, B12, the steps to addressing SIBO,and feel free to ask any questions you might have....and we will help you as best we can.




--

Olesia, owned by Izzy-35lb SWD, Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.3, Stable almost 8 yrs! Once stable, was able to reduce enzymes to only 1/2 tsp of Enzymes with each meal, but after almost 4 years of stabilization... had to increase the amount of enzymes to 3/4 teaspoon with each meal. Feed various grain-free kibble+real meat, 6x pancreatin enzymes from EnzymeDiane. I give 1 tsp of coconut oil one day and 1 tsp salmon oil next day, and also give canned sardines packed without salt or canned herring for extra omega oils.

In Feb 2013, Izzy developed a very serious condition called IMHA which she (thankfully) beat and is now in remission. We also discovered that now, at 8+ years old, she not only has EPI, but also Diabetes, Low Thyroid and High Cholesterol.  Izzy was able to receive excellent care because of the kindness of so many here on epi4dogs and  is currently  doing extra-ordinarily well. If anyone could spend a day with Izzy, they would never guess that she has any health problems!  Because of Izzy's concurrent conditions of Diabetes and High Cholesterol we had to make changes to our daily EPI routine. We had to alter the fiber, type of fiber and the fat content her diet. She was getting Annamaet Lean kibble plus a lean meat and did well on it....... but we have since switched again because of her diabetes to an all home-made diet which she does even better on and has even been able to reduce the Vetsulin (por-based insulin) dose from 9 units to 6 units... because of the diet change to all home-made i no longer worry about hypoglycemia- -she is much more even keeled with a diet of sweet potato+ a lean meat+coconut oil/fish oil+vitamins and bone meal. We tried Novolin N a human synthetic RNA insulin.... but Izzy did not do well on it. aside from all of Izzy's health issues.... she continues to wake up every day full of joy and a great sense of humor!


December 26, 2012 at 12:26 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Paula
Member
Posts: 2634

Jessica - Yes, you can still give her her oral meds. I like to give around a meal, but I'm not even sure if you have to. Others will chime in, but short answer, no need to change.

--

Paula and Maya (bday 12/21/06) (diagnosed 10/26/10 TLI 1.5, B12 659 (ref:249-733), weight 52 lbs. After 30 days, retested B12/folate - B12 plummeted to 200, which greatly affected her personality. After following B12 protocol, currently giving semi-weekly B12 shots at home, plus daily WonderLabs Trinfac. Weight in July 2013: 75 lbs - the picture of health


December 26, 2012 at 12:42 PM Flag Quote & Reply

jebel321
Member
Posts: 30

Another question...I see cold packs as an option for ordering enzymes from Diane's website. Do I need to order these to have enzymes shipped to me?

--

Buttercup diagnosed with EPI in November 2012.

Currently on 2 1/2 cups a day (1 1/2 cups AM/1 cup in PM) of Nutro Grain Free Venison & Potato (12% fat & 3% fiber)

1 1/2  tsp. 6x enzymes per meal incubated for 20 minutes

B12 pill daily

December 26, 2012 at 12:46 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Paula
Member
Posts: 2634

Not this time of year - only in the heat of the summer, when they could bake in a mailbox and exceed 130 degrees, which will kill the enzymes.

--

Paula and Maya (bday 12/21/06) (diagnosed 10/26/10 TLI 1.5, B12 659 (ref:249-733), weight 52 lbs. After 30 days, retested B12/folate - B12 plummeted to 200, which greatly affected her personality. After following B12 protocol, currently giving semi-weekly B12 shots at home, plus daily WonderLabs Trinfac. Weight in July 2013: 75 lbs - the picture of health


December 26, 2012 at 12:49 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Tracey, Sofie's mom
Member
Posts: 1662

Diane tries not to ship so that enzymes will be sitting for days somewhere but being as you're in Texas I believe? you might want to discuss with Diane. I don't believe it is really necessary but please check to be sure and to ease your mind.

--

Tracey, Sofie's mom

Sofie, Shiloh shepherd, born March 2010; diagnosed April 2011. Currently eats 3.5 cups of TOTW Lamb per day plus a bit of cooked beef, pork, tripe or liver, etc. with 1 tsp. of 8x enzymes per cup. 1 Wonderlabs B12 pill per day, 1 tbsp coconut oil 2x a day and currently back on Tylan 2x a day. Her lowest weight was 66 lbs, she is now a lovely 85 lbs.

December 26, 2012 at 12:51 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Jean and Kara
Member
Posts: 5747

hI

 

please ring Diane she will be pleased to advise you, she is Olesias right hand and the forum Angel

 

if I were you get a large glass of whatever and treat today as the first day of the rest of Buttercups life

 

the log and in my case a note book is essential

--

 

 

Kara

 

From Liverpool England


born 21st July 2009


adopted at five months old 26th December 2009

 

EPI dx August 2010


tli<1.00 folate 8.3 cobalimin 611

Antibiotics  2 Oxytet antibiotics 3 times a day also if we cannot fit the Oxytet in she has Tylan 1/8th teaspoon before her meals as a maintenanance dose

Food- Ashenbank Lamb Casserole  twice daily equalling 3 cups per day possibly more

Zantac (ranitadine) 75 mg 30 minutes before each meal as too much acid was being produced, causing shedding of bowel lining

enzymes-Panzym 1 gram per meal twice daily ( 1/4 teaspoon )  plus one Lypex

B12 injection once every three weeks

one Chemeyes B12 with intrinsic factor of 40 daily

one Antepsin before bedtime

alergies to beef pork chicken and white fish confirmed by blood test

33.6 kilos in weight as of 5th May 2013

39 kilos as of 10th June 2014

 

"UNCONDITIONAL LOVE WAS INVENTED BY DOGS"

 

 


December 26, 2012 at 12:57 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Paula
Member
Posts: 2634

Oh, yeah, it gets hot in Texas, even in December. Sorry, I lived in Houston for 5 years (fondly remember writing Christmas cards sitting by the pool), should have thought of that. Yes. Ask Diane.

--

Paula and Maya (bday 12/21/06) (diagnosed 10/26/10 TLI 1.5, B12 659 (ref:249-733), weight 52 lbs. After 30 days, retested B12/folate - B12 plummeted to 200, which greatly affected her personality. After following B12 protocol, currently giving semi-weekly B12 shots at home, plus daily WonderLabs Trinfac. Weight in July 2013: 75 lbs - the picture of health


December 26, 2012 at 1:00 PM Flag Quote & Reply

jebel321
Member
Posts: 30

Sorry I am rapid firing questions today. I promise they will die down once we get started on our regimen. Buttercup has some fleas...do you all have any idea if I can use Frontline right now?  I am only really concerned because she is in a fragile state of sorts and I wasn't sure if it would aggravate things. (I thought I had Comfortis at home, but it turns out we don't.)

Thanks again!

Jessica

--

Buttercup diagnosed with EPI in November 2012.

Currently on 2 1/2 cups a day (1 1/2 cups AM/1 cup in PM) of Nutro Grain Free Venison & Potato (12% fat & 3% fiber)

1 1/2  tsp. 6x enzymes per meal incubated for 20 minutes

B12 pill daily

December 26, 2012 at 2:46 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Tracey, Sofie's mom
Member
Posts: 1662

Jessica, no need to be sorry - that's why someone tries to stay close by:)

 

Frontline is ok - fleas would be worse:)

--

Tracey, Sofie's mom

Sofie, Shiloh shepherd, born March 2010; diagnosed April 2011. Currently eats 3.5 cups of TOTW Lamb per day plus a bit of cooked beef, pork, tripe or liver, etc. with 1 tsp. of 8x enzymes per cup. 1 Wonderlabs B12 pill per day, 1 tbsp coconut oil 2x a day and currently back on Tylan 2x a day. Her lowest weight was 66 lbs, she is now a lovely 85 lbs.

December 26, 2012 at 3:09 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Michele
Administrator
Posts: 6131

I never discontinued my Frontline or Heartguard when Jackie was first diagnosed - they are safe to use.   I used to just give the Heartguard near a meal this way I knew she had enzymes in her to maybe help with the Heartguard.    Keep asking your questions - don't worry - we are glad to help out.   Be sure your vet gives you generic B12 shots - not multivitamin.   You can even do the shots at home and save some $$ - ask him to show you how.   My vet used to give me preloaded syringes (before I switched to the pills).    

--

Michele

http://gardensoftranquility.com/



Jackie - Diagnosed at 9 mos (09/09) - TLI 0.3 and low end of B12.  Pancreatin 8x dosing 3/4tsp per cup.   TOTW High Prarie, Trinfac-B Intrinsic Factor daily, probiotics and Duralactin in the am. Mega-E:  cisapride and metoclopramide.    Stable and happy 122lbs - thanks to all the beautiful souls on this forum, we could not have done it without YOU.

Dexter - Diagnosed 11/10 approx 3 yrs of age.   We failed fostering and now he has his forever home :)   At initial testing - TLI 1.2 (range 5-35) B12 254 (range 249-733) folate 20.2 (range 6.5-11.5)   TOTW High Prarie, Pancreatin 8x dosing is 3/4 tsp per cup, Trinfac-B Intrinsic Factor daily, probiotics with each meal and glucosamine chondroitin in the am.  Hypothyroidism:   Soloxine.    Stable and happy 97 lbs.


December 26, 2012 at 3:34 PM Flag Quote & Reply

jebel321
Member
Posts: 30

Michele,

Why'd you switch from injections to pills?

--

Buttercup diagnosed with EPI in November 2012.

Currently on 2 1/2 cups a day (1 1/2 cups AM/1 cup in PM) of Nutro Grain Free Venison & Potato (12% fat & 3% fiber)

1 1/2  tsp. 6x enzymes per meal incubated for 20 minutes

B12 pill daily

December 26, 2012 at 3:35 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Jean and Kara
Member
Posts: 5747

we use the tablets-capsules as a supplement to the injections in other words a maintenance level

 

Kara has one every other day and an injection every month and we are 2.5 years down the line

 

But Michele will answer why she changed

 

I cannot afford to let her levels drop and she is on antibiotics for life for SIBO other wise known as bad bugs in the gut as we cannot control it

 

jean

--

 

 

Kara

 

From Liverpool England


born 21st July 2009


adopted at five months old 26th December 2009

 

EPI dx August 2010


tli<1.00 folate 8.3 cobalimin 611

Antibiotics  2 Oxytet antibiotics 3 times a day also if we cannot fit the Oxytet in she has Tylan 1/8th teaspoon before her meals as a maintenanance dose

Food- Ashenbank Lamb Casserole  twice daily equalling 3 cups per day possibly more

Zantac (ranitadine) 75 mg 30 minutes before each meal as too much acid was being produced, causing shedding of bowel lining

enzymes-Panzym 1 gram per meal twice daily ( 1/4 teaspoon )  plus one Lypex

B12 injection once every three weeks

one Chemeyes B12 with intrinsic factor of 40 daily

one Antepsin before bedtime

alergies to beef pork chicken and white fish confirmed by blood test

33.6 kilos in weight as of 5th May 2013

39 kilos as of 10th June 2014

 

"UNCONDITIONAL LOVE WAS INVENTED BY DOGS"

 

 


December 26, 2012 at 4:37 PM Flag Quote & Reply

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