Dog not responding after 5 months

Epi4Dogs Foundation Inc.’s mission is the advancement of science and education relating to EPI (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency), yielding useful insights and positive outcomes in better managing EPI in dogs and cats. Our goals are to support and/or collaborate with veterinary EPI research and researchers, and to promote EPI awareness by educating the general public, pet owners, pet organizations, rescue and shelter organizations, veterinary schools and veterinarians.
Tuckaboo Pam
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Posts: 1345
Country: United States
State: Florida
Pet name: Tucker
My name: Pam H.

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by Tuckaboo Pam » 02 Oct 2021, 16:31

Thank you for getting back with a recap. When I write, I can't always figure out how to get back for reference.

Tucker was diagnosed without the fasting blood work, by an old-school vet, and was successfully treated for two years before I could afford the test. I'm glad I got it done, but I knew he had EPI.

One thing that helped me was this video by Dr. Becker. I learned about EPI while reading a rescue story, looked it up, and wow, Tucker had most of the symptoms. I'll give you the link, in case you're interested.

https://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/h ... -dogs.aspx

---Pam
Tucker was a shepherd/lab mix--- TLI 1.3, Folate 9.7, Cobalamin 666, Lipase 38. Took Diane's Enzymes 4 teaspoons/day, Wonderlabs B12 one capsule per day, and Tylan 1/16 teaspoon/ morning (to hold SID at bay). Taste of the Wild High Prairie, 1 1/2 cups/day, with a total of 4 cups of Fresh Pet. Stopped eating everything in sight, and went from 60 to 85 pounds! Tucker was my boyfriend, and my husband was OK with that. Tucker succumbed to hemangiosarcoma, but we cherished every day we had with that wonderful, beautiful boy. I will always, always miss my sweet big boy.

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Olesia711
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Location: North Carolina
Country: United States
State: North Carolina
Pet name: Izzy
My name: olesia

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by Olesia711 » 02 Oct 2021, 21:04

EXCELLENT!!!!!!!!!! Keep on reporting here and don't worry if you see improvement but then a step backward in the poo dept. What you want is that the general direction of things is improvement even though it might not be perfect yet .

I suspect the improvement is from the increased enzymes. Keep this up but this might be a clue that the TOTW although usually decent for most EPI dogs, it might not be optimal for your dog. Eventually you may need to change the food... or not..... don't do anything yet, just record what you are doing, give things time and then we will help you assess the situation :)
Olesia, was owned by Izzy, a 35lb Spanish Water Dog (SWD), Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.. Izzy passed away on February 13, 2020 at 15 years old. She lived with EPI for 13+1/2 years. It was because of Izzy that Epi4Dogs was started... she was the inspiration. May her legacy of helping others with EPI continue for as long as needed.........

Barb
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Country: United States
State: New Jersey

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by Barb » 05 Oct 2021, 16:13

Hi Barb,.

I could have sworn I responded to your post.......but maybe it sailed into cyberspace. I just wanted to welcome you and thank you for your generous care of Sarge. He is very lucky to have landed with you and he is already on his way to good health with you. Not everyone would have taken him in with his condition. But with all the good advice you have already received, you will have him thriving in no time.

Thank you.

Another Barb

barbhamon@gmail.com
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Posts: 13
Country: United States
State: Kentucky
Pet name: Sarge
My name: Barb

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by barbhamon@gmail.com » 14 Oct 2021, 09:00

Hello everyone. I just wanted to give an update on Sarge. Today he got his last B12 shot and in a month he will get his bloodwork drawn for his B12 and TLI test. I have followed the guidelines Olesia suggested and it seems to be working, with minor ups and downs. I have changed his enzymes to 8X and use 1 tsp. per cup of food. His stools have gotten better, and I have now had 3 consecutive days with well formed, semi solid, not so much volumn and dark brown poop. Yay! I know the light at the end of the tunnel isn't as close as I'd like it to be or that I will ever hope to reach it, but I now feel it is a light and not an oncoming train. Thanks to all for your encouragement, advice and personal journeys with this disease. Sarge doesn't seem to be gaining weight, but I'm sure once he is stable this will come. For now he is active and in good health other than his EPI. He came through the bloat surgery well and his recovery was great. His staples are out now and he is resuming his normal (?) ativities. I will make sure to post his TLI scores once I have them.

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jilbert57
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Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by jilbert57 » 14 Oct 2021, 09:49

Hi Barb and thank you for continuing to post updates.
Solid poop is good! And may it continue.
You sound like you have your pup on the best protocol for success.
Are you per chance keeping a daily diary?
https://epi4dogs.com/epi-log/

Jill
My name is Jill and we live on the Hood Canal in Washington State. We currently have 2 Jack russells, TJ is 8 and Sadie is 2.

Mickey and his pancreatitis brought me to Epi4dogs.com site in 2012 to help manage it.
He lived from 6/99 - 8/2014

Mickey, Jack Russell. Chronic Pancreatitis. Dianes enzymes, 1/8t 3x/day with meals.

barbhamon@gmail.com
Member
Posts: 13
Country: United States
State: Kentucky
Pet name: Sarge
My name: Barb

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by barbhamon@gmail.com » 14 Oct 2021, 18:39

Yes I am keeping a daily journal as Olesia suggested. It has been extremely helpful in tracking Sarge's progress and I will take it to the next vet appointment so I can let him know what's been transpiring. It has also helped me with my feelings of no progress. When I look back over the past few weeks, I can now see the ups and downs, but the ups are more than the downs. Being human I tend to focus more on the downs and put more emphasis on them. The journal helps me get a better perspective on the whole picture. I'm sure at some point I can report that he is gaining weight, but for now at least he isn't losing. I work with K-9's and handlers so I've been able to take Sarge with me, keep track of his weight and have been training him in article search. He has so much drive and I have to make sure I keep his mental state as stable as his health. Through all he has been through these past few months his spirit hasn't suffered and I will do whatever it takes to keep him happy and healthy.

barbhamon@gmail.com
Member
Posts: 13
Country: United States
State: Kentucky
Pet name: Sarge
My name: Barb

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by barbhamon@gmail.com » 29 Oct 2021, 19:24

I have a question. Sarge has had good poops for about 2 weeks. He will go for his tli and B12 bloodtest 11/15/21. He has still not gained any weight and still extremely hungry. I have heard that adding coconut oil will help his weight gain as well as his itching (his coat is not good). I know if I add this it will have to be slowly to keep from upsetting his digestive tract. He is getting 150% of his normal food. My question is about the actual coconut oil. Is it a solid or a liquid, and if I feed 1 tsp. would that be measured as the solid, or would it be liquid? I hope this makes sense but I am confused on this oil. I have added salmon oil to dog's food before, but it has always been liquid or spray and mainly for the coat. Thanks in advance for any advice. Oh, he is not getting any other additives except for 1 b12 capsule 3 times per week.

Tuckaboo Pam
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Posts: 1345
Country: United States
State: Florida
Pet name: Tucker
My name: Pam H.

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by Tuckaboo Pam » 30 Oct 2021, 19:59

YEA for good poops! Good job!

Coconut oil solidifies when it's cold, and at room temperature in my Florida house, it can become a liquid. So, I would just measure it, in whatever form yours is. I really don't think there's a difference, like water & ice, but then I could be wrong. I am an inaccurate baker & cook, too. Good to add it slowly, like you said. Tucker loves it, but I thought it was giving him hives, so I stopped.

I wish I could remember how long it took Tucker to gain his weight, but I can't. I'll go back & read my posts to try & find the one where he had become a chunky monkey & get back to you.

So, Tucker gained 20 pounds all in all, and he is ravenous to this day. I feed him Sport Dog Elite buffalo & sweet potato, 25% more than the recommended amount, and he will still go around looking for food after his meal. I have to feed all my dogs separately, to keep him from stealing somebody else's meal. I think maybe the feeling of hunger that he had for all his early years, has affected him for life.

---Pam

OK, I'm back in time to edit my post. I wrote that after three months Tucker was looking handsome with the inches he had gained. This must've been before he got too fat.
I also noted that it wasn't until the addition of Tylan, that I noticed any changes at all.
Tucker was a shepherd/lab mix--- TLI 1.3, Folate 9.7, Cobalamin 666, Lipase 38. Took Diane's Enzymes 4 teaspoons/day, Wonderlabs B12 one capsule per day, and Tylan 1/16 teaspoon/ morning (to hold SID at bay). Taste of the Wild High Prairie, 1 1/2 cups/day, with a total of 4 cups of Fresh Pet. Stopped eating everything in sight, and went from 60 to 85 pounds! Tucker was my boyfriend, and my husband was OK with that. Tucker succumbed to hemangiosarcoma, but we cherished every day we had with that wonderful, beautiful boy. I will always, always miss my sweet big boy.

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Madelon
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State: Tennessee
Pet name: Doc

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by Madelon » 31 Oct 2021, 16:32

Hi! With regard to the coconut oil, we recommend using cold pressed organic coconut oil - it's a solid white. Just start off with a small amount - maybe a 1/4tsp and watch the poops. My boy cannot tolerate even the smallest amount of coconut oil. It could be that he needs more B12 but you'll be able to tell from the B12 test. My boy gets 1 B12 pill twice a day - I've tried to back him down to 1 B12 pill a day and he immediately loses weight - once I go back to 2 pills a day he gains the weight back. Also, some EPI dogs are slow to gain their weight back as it takes time for their bodies to heal from the inside.
Madelon, owned by DOC. DOC dx EPI 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24. DOC taught me so much and together we battled and overcame EPI, food sensitivies, environmental allergies but we lost the cancer battle. DOC was dx with hemangiosarcoma 5/2022 and crossed the rainbow bridge July 24, 2022. He is and always will be the love of my life, my soulmate, my heart dog.

Barb
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Country: United States
State: New Jersey

Re: Dog not responding after 5 months

Post by Barb » 31 Oct 2021, 16:54

Hi Barb,
Congratulations on those poops. That is definitely one of the ups.
I am glad you are benefitting from keeping the journal. I found it so informative when we were keeping Kolby's. It really saved our sanity.

Kolby was one of the slow gainers in the weight department. It took him over a year to get to his target weight. Like Sarge, he stabilized and wasn't losing, but like Madelon's pup, Kolby didn't gain until we got his B12 levels up. So it will be interesting to see what Sarge's B12 level is.

Hang in there......keep focusing on the "ups."

Barb

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