Another Finn Update

[worriedparents]

Back from our latest vet app't. We are getting a culture done on today's urine sample to see if everything has cleared up. He's still good as far as leaking urine. A little bit of wetness on the floor last night but not much. Going to watch that closely because it appears the problem all along was an undetected infection (possibly inflammation too, but more likely infection). I feel so bad we didn't know that in the fall, even with app'ts and testing, and it could have been easily fixed.

He's gained another couple pounds in the last week. He loses quickly but when he gets eating again, he can gain back quickly too.

Unfortunately, two of his previous issues are back to the forefront again too. He's been on Clopidogrel since we stopped seeing blood in the urine, but not the Xarelto. Yesterday on a walk he was dragging his back feet, so we are worried his clot has returned. He's going back on the Xarelto today and will be getting another ultrasound to reassess. Our vet said his pulse was greatly reduced on the left hind leg again. Finn has some hind end weakness too, which can contribute to urinary problems, but getting weak in the back end while walking was how the clot presented last time.

And the other problem the since yesterday is head shaking again. His ears are clear, so likely food sensitivity is affecting him. My husband had increased the turkey ratio and it's possible that made him worse. He can eat something fine and do well on it and then if his stomach gets upset he refuses to eat that food and if we start it back up again later it seems to cause him problems when he didn't have one before. He's so picky to begin with and this really complicates feeding him. At least Reactine seems to help and it's not like it was in the fall when his face swelled and he was really violently shaking his head. Ugh.

Our vet thinks his urine issues are tied into his imbalanced gut flora too and wants him on a probiotic. We tried probiotics and then slippery elm prior to ever starting Tylosin, they didn't seem to make any change for him, but maybe they will now that he's on Tylosin. Although if I remember it's not recommended for slippery elm and Tylosin to be given together? Or am I thinking of something else? We know he can improve and require less Tylosin with the ideal protein source for him. It would just be nice if that protein source could be a long-term one. The name he gave me for a probiotic though is not one I can find around here. He just got back from a conference in the US and must have heard about it there. And he mentioned maybe trying D-mannose for urinary problems.

[jilbert57]

The slippery elm coats the throat lining and gut and slows or inhibits absorption so I would give one then wait an hour before the other.
D-mannose helps make the walls of the bladder
slippery so things don't stick to it, like bacteria.

[Madelon]

Olesia has said in the past you can give Slippery Elm with Tylan that it likely won't reduce the effect of Tylan by much but it's not recommended to give it with medications that are really precise and treating critical issues. I'm so sorry your sweet boy is going through so much.

[jilbert57]

Thank you Madelon for pointing that out!

[Olesia711]

Everyone gave you good info about Tylan and SLippery Elm..... so, you are all set on that.... however........ i would also like to mention that your vet's suggestion of D- Mannose....is an excellent suggestion... something i would definitely try.

In the meantime.... if you can, you might want to read the UTI page we have here on the website:
https://epi4dogs.com/urinary-tract-infection/

as it gets into the nitty gritty of different UTI's, repeated UTI's and how to address them based on what kind they are..........unfortunately with UTI's it is not always a simply/easy solution.........

[worriedparents]

Thanks everyone, really appreciate it. He got us up in the middle of the night shaking his head again, about 7 hours after he ate beef, carrots and sweet potato. I think the head shaking is starting to affect his hearing a bit, like it did in the fall, even though he's not nearly doing it as much as he did then. Enough to be concerning though.

We knew the beef was causing him to rub his face at times but he wouldn't eat turkey after he got sick so we were kind of at a loss what to feed him. Maybe he hit his threshold of how much beef (if that's the allergen) that his body could handle. This morning he was hungry and ate only turkey (a smaller meal), so if that isn't a problem at least he is back to eating it. So far he hasn't shaken his head yet. Maybe not enough time has passed, and he's been laying down and he does it more when he stands up. Hopefully we can figure out what he's eating that is causing the problem and eliminate it and work up from there. I'm going to read more about the nutriscan testing because we got lucky over the winter and our luck has run out again.

I still have slippery elm. Going to put that on the next meal because he doesn't get meds with that meal anyway. He had it before so we'll see how it goes. When we first got him, before we knew about SID and what was wrong with him exactly, we gave him Fortiflora. Oh, did that give him terrible smelling gas, we kept it up but it didn't help. We have a (pet) store bought probiotic here that we tried with him several months ago, and again like the enzymes, you sprinkle it on his food and he won't eat. Because of the size of him and the amount of scoops it says to give, if we went the capsule route it would be a crazy amount.

Going to pick up some d-mannose this afternoon for him and my mom. I don't like giving antibiotics and would prefer preventatives instead of playing catchup all the time. My mom, who tested negative again, had to have antibiotics for pneumonia last month and after that she had a really hard time getting rid of thrush. While I have no doubt Finn needed the antibiotics for his UTI, I also think that's why he's having an increased sensitivities now. I should look back and see if he was on antibiotics for a UTI prior to the allergic reaction in the fall, that would be an interesting coincidence.

[Olesia711]

Finn sure is lucky, VERY lucky to have you as his loving care-giver/doggie mom!!!! ...and i am more than impressed with how much time you take to dig into the details to see what the triggers might be and what adverse reactions may happen and which meds may conflict with other meds...........

[Madelon]

I agree - Finn is one lucky pup to have you!!! If you think he has food sensitivities have you thought about doing the NutriScan food sensitivity test? You may have already figured out his sensitivities through trial and error but if not I highly recommend this test. I did it when my Doc was plagued with ear infections and skin infections etc - once I chose a food based on their recommendations of what to avoid it cleared up.

[worriedparents]

Thanks. The receptionist at our vet says he's a Rags to Riches story because of what he's been through. If he is, he's our Riches to Rags story because he's been such an expensive family member.

Without eating beef over the weekend there hasn't been any head shaking or need for Reactine. Yah! So looks like he hit the limit of beef that his body could tolerate. He was really hungry and really tired, which looking at the start of this thread, happened last time he went on Xarelto.

Thankfully he was eating turkey eagerly, until this morning when my husband put salmon oil on it. He's had salmon oil on his food for years. We stopped it for a few days and with that little adjustment, he refused to eat. Not because he's not feeling well, he's just picky. And he's not picky as in he doesn't really want this now but if I get hungry enough I might later, instead he runs away from it like you are trying to poison him. He's a strange animal.

We tried straight turkey without anything on it later and he wouldn't touch it either. He did however happily eat chicken so we will see how poorly he reacts to that now. Ugh. And he was eating turkey with slippery elm on it (somewhat cautiously but would eat it), which doesn't smell that great to me. I'm going to order a very expensive probiotic and hold my breath if he'd actually eat it or not.

He is having a hard time (hind end weakness) getting up from a laying down position so really want to get that ultrasound to check the clot. Another reason we wanted him back on his fish oil quickly too.

As far as itchy skin and sensitivities, Finn doesn't have any visible skin problems or patchy fur. He's got a nice coat. He didn't even have hot spots with the last reaction, just shaking his head and runny eyes a little. He will sometimes lick his legs, mostly front or sometimes back.

Madelon, do you have to get the nutriscan through a vet or order it on your own? I talked to our vet about that this morning.

[jilbert57]

I believe you can read about and order it here:

https://www.nutriscan.org/

Hope this helps.