Confirmed EPI

[Angboys3]

Our standard Poodle Bella came back with a definite diagnosis of EPI.

The vet called and said her test result was a .6 so it was pretty clear EPI. She said the B12 was in the mid range and the folate was fine. She said she does not have pancreatitis and that all the other blood work was good. I will get the exact numbers later.

So glad that we can start figuring out things! She seems less starved now, is filling out after 5 1/2 days of enzymes. She is playful again. Poop is firmer but not totally there yet but I know we will get it figured out.

Just waiting for our wonderlab B12 and a larger bag of Diane’s enzymes. Going to start there and see where we need to go next.

[Olesia711]

sorry about the EPI diagnosis.... BUT the good news is that EPI is manageable... once you find the right balance of EPI protocol that best will suit Bella.

Please do give us the B12 levels when you can- -as sometimes mid-range is not good enough.

Also... the folate score is pretty useless.... too many times when it is in the normal range..veterinarian researchers have stopped using it as a guideline. unfortunately this has not yet filtered down to vets everywhere- -but in time, it will

" Folate test results such as Culturing, Counting bacterial numbers, and Duodenal juice collection all have majors flaws in their technique rendering them inaccurate indications of SID/SIBO. Recent studies have determined that it is not the number of bacteria but rather “the type of flora and/or how the host and flora interact that are more important than numbers.”

And what they have recently discovered is that in EPI dogs, the gut flora is completely different than all other gastro conditions. For example, EPI dogs do not have enough bacteria nor do they have enough of a variety of bacteria.... so it is a double punch

IN any case, no matter what the Folate score is in an EPI dog, the dog still has SID.... the latest finding (research) is that all EPI dogs have SID.... the issue is to keep it or get it under good control. (normal poos)

So... sounds like for now... things have improved... but... if things go south or do not optimally improve, that just means that something needs to be tweaked (adjusted).... and that is what we will help you with.

Please keep us posted!

[Angboys3]

Interesting about the Folate! Should I try Slippery Elm if the B12 addition doesn’t get her to normal?

She is still having some reflux type symptoms and gurgling tummy. Our vet wants to give the enzymes more time to work before trying antibiotic. Our vet doesn’t seem like she has much experience with EPI. But at least she seems willing to learn. It’s been like 6 days on enzymes. Tablets first and then the powder.

I was going to give her the B12 anyway. I would rather give her the vitamins, just in case, especially if it is not toxic to her. She wasn’t in the high range so I am sure she might need them.

[Olesia711]

AHhhhhhhhhhhh...."She is still having some reflux type symptoms and gurgling tummy. Our vet wants to give the enzymes more time to work before trying antibiotic. Our vet doesn’t seem like she has much experience with EPI. But at least she seems willing to learn. It’s been like 6 days on enzymes. Tablets first and then the powder. "

Although your vet is new at this.... the fact that she is trying to learn with you is excellent. Actually these are the vets that often turn out to be the best!

SO....... since it has been 6 days on the enzymes and you are still dealing with the acid reflux and tummy gurgling... that is most likely SID that now needs addressing.... BUT..... before you try the antibiotics (and the drug of choice would be Tylan first) ... i would definitely try SLippery Elm powder first... as SE is a prebiotic (feeds bacteria and EPI dogs do not have enough bacteria in the gur flora nor do they have enough variety of bacteria) ..... and it is a mucilage and has just enough SCFAs in it (mostly Butyrate) that is known for fighting SID.... and sometimes this is just enough to help get SID under good control without resorting to an antibiotic.... So YES.... try slippery elm first... but if you do not see any improvement at all..... then try Tylan antibiotic.....

With Slippery Elm powder check out the Slippery Elm page
https://epi4dogs.com/slippery-elm/
... there are dosing instructions there (always get powder not capsules!!!) and please know that sometimes less works even better...... so you might want to try a little less to begin with.

[Madelon]

While I’m sorry it’s definitely EPI as Olesia said it’s manageable. Keep a detailed log of everything that goes in and everything that comes out (poop) so you can figure out what works and what doesn’t.

Please know we are all here to help guide you on this new journey.

[jilbert57]

Welcome to the forum. Glad you have a definitive diagnosis so you can proceed down a path! Please ask any questions.

[Bpcooper14]

Welcome to the club! I've not been here long myself but everyone has been supremely supportive and have a wealth of knowledge. RIght now you don't know what you don't know.

[Riley's Mom]

I'll add my welcome as well.
Sorry you got the diagnosis of EPI, but honestly once you get things dialed in for your pup it will become routine. I promise. I didn't believe it in the beginning, but it does get easier to manage.
There is a lot of good information on this site, take a look around and please ask questions as you have them.
Try not to get too overwhelmed, it's a lot to take in at the beginning. You have already cleared the first hurdle by getting a diagnosis!

[Barb]

A warm welcome to you and Bella, officially, now that you have a diagnosis. Although it's not the gift you hoped for, now that you have it, you can help Bella to good health. I heartily endorse Madelon's suggestion to keep a daily log. It saved our sanity and is a very effective tool to seeing what is going on with your pup.

Ask any questions you have.

Barb

[Stacie & Dizzy]

I just wanted to say welcome to the group. I know you didn't want the EPI diagnosis, but now you can get your pup better. You've already been given great advice from everyone. The B12 from Wonderlabs was the final piece of the EPI puzzle that helped my girl start gaining weight again.