Demodex, ugh!

[SimonSays]

Hi all, I am amazed how many people are on this forum. It took my vet forever to think of EPI with my GSD. It seems so common.

My guy is 4 years old, I've had him for 3 years. He was a complete mess and had severe demodex when I first got him. I found that Nexgard kept it under control (did all the shampoos and dips, then some other shampoos and dips, to no avail) and once treatment for SIBO and EPI was underway, he gained weight, his coat grew in beautifully.

Today, I noticed 2 spots of demodex. He just had his Nexgard 3 days ago and I have given it to him faithfully, every month. Is it possible for the mites to become immune? How can I beef up his system to fight these critters.

I live on a very tight budget and have just now, 3 years later, paid off the vet bills. My vet, a female, has moved across the state, and with covid, I can't go into the office with him, they will had to sedate him. I would prefer not to do that, if at all possible. I never intended to keep him, he was to go to a rescue from the chain he was on, but his attitude stinks. He has an aversion to men, the kind that says 'kill, kill, kill' veins in his teeth kind of thing, no rescue would touch him. So I decided to love him and hope to outlive him. That being said, I do want to find a way to keep the mites at bay. If I can't and it continues to spread, well, I am afraid of what might need to be done. Any and all suggestions are greatly appreciated.

[Olesia711]

Well, you sure labeled your topic appropriately..... "Demodex, UGH!" i am so sorry your dog is struggling with this. Unfortunately, with EPI their systems are immune compromised and then they are more susceptible to things like this. SOOOooooo frustrating!

Aside from boosting the immune systems by finding the right balance of the recommended EPI treatment (right amount of enzymes, an agreeable diet, B12 (usually needed sooner or later) and keeping SID under good management, The only thing i can recommend is upping the diet with more wholesome foods that will supply better/more "usable" vitamins and minerals. For example "vegetable and legume starches, such as potatoes, sweet potatoes, and lentils, are not as acidifying and inflammatory as starchy grains" SO..... try to feed a more grain-free, starch-free (if possible) diet that also includes fresh meat and vegetables.

For example, my EPI gal developed IMHA (Immune mediated hemolytic anemia, diabetes, and low thyroid) . We started out with EPI, so i already did the "grain-free" foods.... but when i HAD to better manage her diabetes (which i did with diet in addition to insulin) i learned how to use mostly fresh meats, and some cooked mashed sweet potato, cottage cheese and kale and then with just a little high quality kibble added to the mix. Basically i was doing 80% fresh food and 20% kibble (since kibble was compact it kept the weight up) and i gave a quality doggie vitamin every day with fish oil. I swear, doing mostly home-feeding made a huge difference in her response to fighting all these things that she had. She lived to 15 years old and she was a vibrant little pistol of a dog up until the last few days of her life. Once i switched her to mostly fresh foods, she overall did MUCH better.

Another thing you can do is give your dog a good antioxidant. Something that will fight those darn free radicals triggering inflammation. I personally used (and continue to use for dogs and people in my family) is grape seed extract. Potent antioxidant. Check with your vet for the proper dosage.

And of course be sure to give a quality fish oil, or EFA (essential fatty acid) daily.

And last but not least, check into Tumeric. But have your vet tell you which product and how much to give.... there are so many out there nowadays and with Tumeric, it is not always well controlled.... so talk to your vet about this one...

Hope this helps! I feel for you though, Demodex not fun to deal with..............

[SimonSays]

Thanks so much for the reply. I do have the EPI under control. His stools are good (and he's not eating them , so gross) I don't think I can do raw, though. Affordablility and vegetarianism will keep me from doing the meat part (I literally dry heave at the smell). He loves veggies and I ferment cabbage and carrots for him, which he gets with every meal. I have not been giving fish oil and will get some for him. He is due for a b12 check, but has been getting supplements for the past 2 years. I feed him Earthborn Coastal Catch. It has served him well, until now. He has allergies to chicken and pork (can you imagine!) so he gets plant enzymes, more than he would of the pancreatin, but gotta do what ya gotta do.

I have to find another vet. This dog hates men and totally freaks when they try to handle him. He is a hazard. He gets l theanine before any visits to 'take the edge off'. I use a Baskerville muzzle, but he has battered a few techs with it and left some nasty bruises, when they try to take him from me. I usually handle him and he complies. I worked really hard to get him trained, so my female vet doesn't have a problem with him if I assist, although she has never checked his teeth, that muzzle is not coming off. (I was a tech a million years ago ) I have yet to get him to accept males. My adult son lives with me and he can't get in the door. It's like rotating dogs that fight, it is so inconvenient. I do love this animal, though. He is so well behaved for me, he keeps me moving, loves to play ball and the flirt pole is his heaven. I wish I knew why he behaved this way. I feel someone battered him with a broom/stick, I can't sweep the floor when he's in the room, he cowers and whimpers, it is just so sad, but gunfire, thunder and fireworks he doesn't flinch.

I'm wondering if I should switch to Bravecto and alternate with Nexgard, month to month? It's a different chemical, maybe the mites are immune? This is clearly going to be a lifelong problem for him and I never want him to get to the condition he was in when I first brought him home.

Thanks again. Looking forward to fish breath. No, not really.

[Olesia711]

oh wow!!! i LIKE that you use Theanine for him.... i take that to. Great amino acid!!!!!
Just to clarify..... i didn't do raw either, i did try it long ago (tried doing all raw, but too inconvenient ) so when i mention 80% fresh food, i meant i buy human grade food, like chicken, beef, pork loin, fish and bake at low temps. You might want to try adding real fish..... if you can tolerate that. Earthborn is a good food... at one time i used the Earthborn Primative. Before my EPi gal developed Diabetes, i believed in variety and was constantly switching food brands with my gal... she did great until Diabetes hit, and then i had to revamp everything i did.

You might want to call the vet and ask if you can try the Bravecto for maybe 6 or 8 months and then go back to Nexguard for 6 to 8 months.... and see if the vet thinks that is a good idea. I honestly don't know if the mites can become immune.... that might be another good question for the vet.

My goodness,,,,, it sounds like youreally have your hands full with a male & broom reactive dog. But you are right, you do what you got to do, and sometimes the tough-nuts are the ones that really tug at our hearts! Reactivity is hard to overcome,,,,, but, if you have the time and patience, lots of patience, sometimes it can be overcome. If you are into reading..... check out DogWise, a lot of us that trained working dogs tapped that site for good training book: https://www.dogwise.com/, That was my "go-to" site for dog issues resources.

[SimonSays]

I could handle canned salmon. Would that work? I can certainly up his vegetables. I really don't want to try another kibble, it took a year plus to find one that had no allergens and low enough fiber, then, as you are very familiar with I'm sure, figuring out how much enzyme was necessary. A true nightmare.

You mentioned your dog had diabetes. Could you clue me in on what signs to look for. Recently, Simon has had a 'dribble' not full blown pee, during the night. It is kind of 'thick' sticky, I guess. No strong odor. Is this a sign? Please so no....

I'm on the hunt for a new vet in my area, since mine has bailed for the coast. If I have to have him sedated to run tests, I guess I have no choice. sigh

I can't tell you how much I appreciate your taking the time to help me with this. It's quite different talking with someone who has first hand knowledge. I have read everything I can, some of those citations were impossible to understand and didn't offer any real advice. Thank you so very much.

[Madelon]

Hi and welcome to our EPI family. Olesia has given you great advice so I won't muddy the waters. But I will add to keep a detailed journal of everything you give and the resulting poop so you know what work and what doesn't.

[Mary]

Read up on diametric earth for dogs,use food grade,cheap AND SAFE

[Jean]

Mary thanks for this, I will look it up