Low TLI- worried

Epi4Dogs Foundation Inc.’s mission is the advancement of science and education relating to EPI (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency), yielding useful insights and positive outcomes in better managing EPI in dogs and cats. Our goals are to support and/or collaborate with veterinary EPI research and researchers, and to promote EPI awareness by educating the general public, pet owners, pet organizations, rescue and shelter organizations, veterinary schools and veterinarians.
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mkazin
Member
Posts: 48
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
State: California
Pet name: Scottie
My name: Maia

Low TLI- worried

Post by mkazin » 28 Jul 2020, 23:00

Hi there!
First of all, thank you for everyone's help over the past few months. In many ways, Scottie (1.5 years old, GSD mix, diagnosed about 4 months ago) is doing much better. But one thing is worrying me -- At our 6 week check up, her TLI was still pretty low. We upped the dose to 2 tsp of Pancreatin per meal, and then went back 6 weeks later for another blood test and check up.
We just got a call from the vet, and the TLI is still low. He said he talked to the pathologist in the lab, who said that some dogs consistently test low for TLI, but if their other symptoms are better (weight gain- Scottie has gained 10 points, and hard stools - Scottie hasn't had loose stool since we started her on Pancreatin), then it's fine and we don't need to continue to test her TLI.
My question is-- does a low TLI mean a lessened life span, or any other health issues down the line? I'm worried he didn't go into very deeply. I'm glad she's doing so well outside of that, but the numbers still worry me.
Thank you!!

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jilbert57
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Posts: 2088
Country: United States
State: Washington

Re: Low TLI- worried

Post by jilbert57 » 29 Jul 2020, 00:10

Hi Maia,
Once your dog has been diagnosed with Epi using the Tli test the Tli number will not increase. There is no need to retest.

The dose for your enzymes depends on how much food you feed. 1 level teaspoon enzyme per 1 cup kibble.

Dogs with Epi live a long life and usually pass from other conditions.

Jill
My name is Jill and we live on the Hood Canal in Washington State. We currently have 2 Jack russells, TJ is 8 and Sadie is 2.

Mickey and his pancreatitis brought me to Epi4dogs.com site in 2012 to help manage it.
He lived from 6/99 - 8/2014

Mickey, Jack Russell. Chronic Pancreatitis. Dianes enzymes, 1/8t 3x/day with meals.

mkazin
Member
Posts: 48
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
State: California
Pet name: Scottie
My name: Maia

Re: Low TLI- worried

Post by mkazin » 29 Jul 2020, 00:40

Oh wow. Thank you! I think my vet just didn’t know that and got her tested again... oh well. So glad that’s not bad news for her health.

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Jean
Forum Director
Posts: 1707
Location: South Liverpool
Country: United Kingdom - England
Pet name: Kara, lost 10th May 2019
My name: Jean

Re: Low TLI- worried

Post by Jean » 29 Jul 2020, 02:29

I can concur that the cTLI result will only go down , if at all

I am a bit bewildered that the lab pathologist said what he /she said

An EPI dog will ALWAYS test low once diagnosed

this is the explanation of cTLI

https://epi4dogs.com/tli-universal-testing/

Please feel free to copy anything from the website for EPI4DOGS and share with your vet , maybe he/she doesnt understand EPI , some never see it in their medical career

My Kara was <1 at diagnosis we never got her retested, we lost her at 10 from a non related condition

the result is a result, it does NOT indicate a lesser life span, obviously dogs get health issues along the way but thats "normal" the big thing is the coat shed, its usually massive

So please, stop worrying

I am wondering where you get enzymes from

do you give any b12 supplementation

good news on the weight gain, shows things are improving

keep your diary

so keep the faith and take care


Jeanx
My name is Jean we live in Liverpool in Uk

I am the Forum Director which I am very proud of

My Kara born 21 July 2009 diagnosed with EPI by cTLI test August 2010 TLI = <1...folate 14 Cobalamin 408, shot down to 94, b12 injections every other day

Lowest weight 39 pounds

We used Panzym enzymes, Tylan and Chemeyes b12 capsules

Sadly, on 10th May 2019, we lost her to DM


Jeanx

mkazin
Member
Posts: 48
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
State: California
Pet name: Scottie
My name: Maia

Re: Low TLI- worried

Post by mkazin » 29 Jul 2020, 11:52

Thank you so much Jean and Jill! Yes I wonder if he was covering his tracks by saying the lab pathologist said that some dogs don't have to be retested, so we wouldn't be upset that we got extra tests. Who knows- but I'm just glad this means she's on track and healthy!!

We get Pancreatin 6X from Enzyme Diane, and for now we're giving her PetTinic for the B12. Once it's safe for us to go inside the vet and learn how to administer B12 shots, we will move to the shots. But the tests that reflect her B12 levels are getting better! So that's great.

Maia

Barb
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Posts: 918
Country: United States
State: New Jersey

Re: Low TLI- worried

Post by Barb » 29 Jul 2020, 12:07

Yes, no need for you to worry........the cTLI test is definitive. Once you have your pup tested, you do not need any more TLI tests. Her pancreas cannot do what it is supposed to because of the EPI, so you replace her non-functioning pancreas with enzymes ..... Our Kolby's TLI was less than 1 and he lived to be 11 years old until an aggressive form of cancer, unrelated to EPI, took him.



So glad Scottie is improving. Ask any questions you have.

Does the B12 supplement you are giving have Intrinsic Factor? This is necessary for absorption. Without it, the B12 will not be effective. I don't recognize the name PetTinic unless it's a typo. Wonderlabs provides an excellent product, Pet Factor, with the Intrinsic Factor . Many of us have used it as the B12 supplement for many years.



Barb

mkazin
Member
Posts: 48
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
State: California
Pet name: Scottie
My name: Maia

Re: Low TLI- worried

Post by mkazin » 29 Jul 2020, 18:06

Thanks for checking, Barb! Yes it does have the intrinsic factor, another amazing person on this forum checked that for me when we started giving it to her :).

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Madelon
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Posts: 1317
Location: Nashville, TN
Country: United States
State: Tennessee
Pet name: Doc

Re: Low TLI- worried

Post by Madelon » 29 Jul 2020, 22:44

Hi - glad things are going in the right direction :) And I'll jump on the no more testing bandwagon LOL. Once your dog is definitive TLI you don't need to have it tested again as the pancreas cannot regenerate itself and the enzymes won't make the TLI number go up. Please know that you don't have to switch to the B12 shots if you don't want to. A lot of us actually switch to the WonderLabs Pet Factor B12 pills after doing the shots. And B12 is not something you have to have repeatedly tested either. We usually recommend retesting after a month or two of supplementing B12 and then there's no need to test again unless you suspect based on symptoms that the B12 level has dropped.

Keep us posted on how things are going!
Madelon, owned by DOC. DOC dx EPI 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24. DOC taught me so much and together we battled and overcame EPI, food sensitivies, environmental allergies but we lost the cancer battle. DOC was dx with hemangiosarcoma 5/2022 and crossed the rainbow bridge July 24, 2022. He is and always will be the love of my life, my soulmate, my heart dog.

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