My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Epi4Dogs Foundation Inc.’s mission is the advancement of science and education relating to EPI (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency), yielding useful insights and positive outcomes in better managing EPI in dogs and cats. Our goals are to support and/or collaborate with veterinary EPI research and researchers, and to promote EPI awareness by educating the general public, pet owners, pet organizations, rescue and shelter organizations, veterinary schools and veterinarians.
sienna11711

Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by sienna11711 » 10 Aug 2020, 19:05

How cute!! They are so gorgeous :)

We actually worked with two different trainers before the issue escalated to its current state, they had a similar philosophy, but the amount of micromanaging that I'd have to do to deal with clinginess (I do like to monitor her drinking so that she doesn't pee when asleep), reactivity to dogs, poop eating, food searching, fearfulness with people coming over... it's just too much. I really feel like it's so much more physical. I've honestly probably broken down once every 2 weeks crying because I can only be a hypervigilant owner for so long before it wears on me, on top of laundry and vacuuming every day from all the shedding.

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Olesia711
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Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by Olesia711 » 10 Aug 2020, 20:01

ahhh... i am so sorry that this is all on your shoulders..... that's tough!

I had a friend who was VERY good with dogs... and she would come to my house daily and she'd help me work on my dogs' "reactivity/resource" issues.....and then we'd have a glass of wine :) having a friend to help out or partner that will work with you can make all the difference........
Olesia, was owned by Izzy, a 35lb Spanish Water Dog (SWD), Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.. Izzy passed away on February 13, 2020 at 15 years old. She lived with EPI for 13+1/2 years. It was because of Izzy that Epi4Dogs was started... she was the inspiration. May her legacy of helping others with EPI continue for as long as needed.........

sienna11711

Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by sienna11711 » 10 Aug 2020, 20:34

Yeah, wine is definitely my friend these days!! Lol.

sienna11711

Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by sienna11711 » 18 Aug 2020, 13:20

Hi guys, just wanted to update you.

So we switched to Earthborn Holistics Ocean Fusion and started incubating the kibble for 15-20 min with enzyme powder. She was actually a bit nauseous some days, vomited fishy liquid once, and her stool was half normal and half very soft yellow. I thought it was interesting bc even though it's less fat, it is oily fish based.

I decided to switch her to Halo Vegan Dog Food- only because I suspect she struggles most with animal protein and fats. We are still doing the enzymes. I also have been giving her a thyroid supplement that she previously took that has thyroid glandular and iodine in it. Her stool is bulkier (I imagine from the plant matter), but brown nonetheless, she is calmer, less dog reactive, and when I added in the thyroid supplement her shedding has diminished by 60% in three days and her coat is muchhh softer. She also has less pain in her abdomen when I touch it. No nausea, no vomiting.

So I think it's safe to say no EPI, probably some degree of pancreatic inflammation and trouble with fat, poor digestion of animal protein, and a somewhat underfunctioning thryoid, but nothing definitive. I definitely don't want to keep her on vegan food but if it reduces pain and stress it will just have to work for now until we can figure out why it's so hard for her to process meaty kibble and real food.

I have an upcoming second opinion televisit with a vet who's well versed in nutrition and raw feeding so we will see!

Tuckaboo Pam
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Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by Tuckaboo Pam » 18 Aug 2020, 15:30

Thinking of you... I'm in Gainesville, and I know a great trainer who has a dog with extreme anxiety, and yes, with her every moment is a teaching moment. I would highly recommend her, if you are close. Where are you located?----Pam
Tucker was a shepherd/lab mix--- TLI 1.3, Folate 9.7, Cobalamin 666, Lipase 38. Took Diane's Enzymes 4 teaspoons/day, Wonderlabs B12 one capsule per day, and Tylan 1/16 teaspoon/ morning (to hold SID at bay). Taste of the Wild High Prairie, 1 1/2 cups/day, with a total of 4 cups of Fresh Pet. Stopped eating everything in sight, and went from 60 to 85 pounds! Tucker was my boyfriend, and my husband was OK with that. Tucker succumbed to hemangiosarcoma, but we cherished every day we had with that wonderful, beautiful boy. I will always, always miss my sweet big boy.

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Madelon
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Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by Madelon » 20 Aug 2020, 19:46

Have you thought about trying hydrolyzed prescription food? My boy has problems with fats and is sensitive to LOTS of ingredients - I found doing a mixture of the hydrolyzed prescription food and a "normal" food gave him the best poops.
Madelon, owned by DOC. DOC dx EPI 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24. DOC taught me so much and together we battled and overcame EPI, food sensitivies, environmental allergies but we lost the cancer battle. DOC was dx with hemangiosarcoma 5/2022 and crossed the rainbow bridge July 24, 2022. He is and always will be the love of my life, my soulmate, my heart dog.

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Montgomery
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Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by Montgomery » 29 Aug 2020, 10:49

I just wanted to add that vegan dog food (like Natural Balance and Petcurean, for instance) are 100% complete and balanced and are very, very real foods indeed. If you live in Canada or the US, dog and cat foods should have an AAFCO statement somewhere on the packaging stating whether the food is complete and balanced. If she's doing well with this diet, there is no harm in keeping her on it. I'm glad she's improving!
Montgomery was born 20 March 2012. He eats extra lean ground chicken, lean ground pork and lean ground beef completed with Alnutrin and freeze-dried chicken liver, with hard-cooked egg. He gets two size zero capsules of Enzyme Diane's enzymes at each of his six meals, and a size four capsule of Tylan three times a day. He's a fierce little Spitfire with a roaring Merlin engine.

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Olesia711
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Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by Olesia711 » 29 Aug 2020, 22:03

Hi MOni,
Thanks for the update on Sienna.... Sounds like the vegan food is really helping her. Glad you have a televisist scheduled though to see if this is something that she can stay on or if it will need to eventually be supplemented. And very interesting about the Thyroid med... that is a relief to know that it appears to have helped with her tummy pain, etc.

Sounds like FINALLY you are starting to find things that are helping her feel better.
Please continue to keep us posted, even though this most likely is not EPI.... and i personally would love to hear what the the visit with the vet yields regarding the vegan diet.
Olesia, was owned by Izzy, a 35lb Spanish Water Dog (SWD), Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.. Izzy passed away on February 13, 2020 at 15 years old. She lived with EPI for 13+1/2 years. It was because of Izzy that Epi4Dogs was started... she was the inspiration. May her legacy of helping others with EPI continue for as long as needed.........

sienna11711

Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by sienna11711 » 09 Jan 2021, 12:33

Hi guys,

I'm so sorry I fell off of updates for a few months. My vet ended up insisting we go to a behaviorist, so we did, and the behaviorist put her on Royal Canin hydrolyzed as well as sertraline for anxiety. We stopped all supplements, enzymes, etc to try to figure out what helps, what hurts, etc. There was reduced tummy flinching straightaway and the sertraline definitely helps a but with her overall friendliness with people. She also had a high fecal cortisol level. Her stools on the hydrolyzed diet are normal and we also were able to maintain her weight (58 pounds) eating 3 cups of food (she was previously always eating 4 to maintain her weight), so that's a good thing.

We ended up then going to an internist who basically worked her up for everything including an abdominal ultrasound and found nothing. She decided to give us a small dose of budesonide (a local steroid for the digestive tract) assuming she had some kind of intestinal inflammation going on. The steroid completely eliminated the tummy flinching and she seems more clear/focused/lively but the unfortunate and very EXPECTED side effects- increased thirst, hunger, and agitation. She also is more easily aroused by small dogs and other small animals, and is more confident about being rude when dogs enter her personal space. Sort of like we traded one problem for another lol. We are slowly tapering the steroid to see if we can get a dose that doesn't make her too hungry or thirsty while also keeping the flinching at bay. It has made life a lot harder though- she tries to drink toilet water and gets up to drink every 20-30 min. She also gets way way more stressed at vet visits or going in the car and takes a long time to recover afterwards. She seems frantic and is also more domineering and feisty.

We also learned that she has lower back pain (major flinching when you touch her back end) so the internist prescribed gabapentin for that. I've only given it to her two or three times so far and haven't noticed any change.

Overall I just know that something must be wrong- she is doing all of the classic things she always did when she was younger when she would have health issues bothering her- but the debt is getting crazy and the lack of solid results sucks. I'm thinking to try starting up the digestive enzymes again to see if it helps with the hunger/thirst. We will also be starting up acupuncture for stress and digestion.
Last edited by sienna11711 on 09 Jan 2021, 12:47, edited 1 time in total.

sienna11711

Re: My dog's isssues are running my life and my vet doesn't think there is a problem

Post by sienna11711 » 09 Jan 2021, 12:45

Also, I just looked at the poop chart out of sheer interest (lol) and I guess my girl's stools actually aren't exactly fantastic all the time. I would say she flips between 3 and 4, and sometimes 5 depending on the day, and rarely ever has a 2. And her stools totally stink! So maybe this is an indicator of poor digestive health.

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