Peaches Journey

Epi4Dogs Foundation Inc.’s mission is the advancement of science and education relating to EPI (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency), yielding useful insights and positive outcomes in better managing EPI in dogs and cats. Our goals are to support and/or collaborate with veterinary EPI research and researchers, and to promote EPI awareness by educating the general public, pet owners, pet organizations, rescue and shelter organizations, veterinary schools and veterinarians.
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Madelon
Staff
Posts: 1317
Location: Nashville, TN
Country: United States
State: Tennessee
Pet name: Doc

Re: Peaches Journey

Post by Madelon » 20 Sep 2020, 14:53

Hi there. It sounds like the vomit could be from the SID and/or going too long overnight without food - empty belly. Don't give rantadine - we have found Omeprazole works best for EPI dogs. My boy gets one with ever meal. You can also try giving a small enzyme meal just before bed. When Doc was first diagnosed he was vomiting like that a lot - once I started giving a small enzymed meal before bed he was fine - I was able to cut that out after a while and now he can go months without vomiting but every now and then he will vomit first thing in the am if he's gone too long overnight without food.

It is hard in the beginning trying to get the right balance of things and sometimes you have to go back to the basics - just food, enzymes, B12 and Tylan or Slippery Elm in order to figure things out. I've had to do it several times. I will say my vet - and I personally agree - says it takes weeks for their systems to fully adjust to a food change - my vet recommends after doing the 7 days slow transition to give it another full two weeks on the food - unless you're having explosive diarrhea - to see how they respond to the food.

Hopefully once she's stable you could try going to kibble to help you save some money. Chewy is good about refunding you if the food doesn't work - as long as it's not done a lot. So if the time comes and you try kibble try ordering from Chewy (you can order Sport Dog Food Elite from Chewy).

Sending you hugs!
Madelon, owned by DOC. DOC dx EPI 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24. DOC taught me so much and together we battled and overcame EPI, food sensitivies, environmental allergies but we lost the cancer battle. DOC was dx with hemangiosarcoma 5/2022 and crossed the rainbow bridge July 24, 2022. He is and always will be the love of my life, my soulmate, my heart dog.

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Madelon
Staff
Posts: 1317
Location: Nashville, TN
Country: United States
State: Tennessee
Pet name: Doc

Re: Peaches Journey

Post by Madelon » 20 Sep 2020, 15:27

Hi there. It sounds like the vomit could be from the SID and/or going too long overnight without food - empty belly. Don't give rantadine - we have found Omeprazole works best for EPI dogs. My boy gets one with ever meal. You can also try giving a small enzyme meal just before bed. When Doc was first diagnosed he was vomiting like that a lot - once I started giving a small enzymed meal before bed he was fine - I was able to cut that out after a while and now he can go months without vomiting but every now and then he will vomit first thing in the am if he's gone too long overnight without food.

It is hard in the beginning trying to get the right balance of things and sometimes you have to go back to the basics - just food, enzymes, B12 and Tylan or Slippery Elm in order to figure things out. I've had to do it several times. I will say my vet - and I personally agree - says it takes weeks for their systems to fully adjust to a food change - my vet recommends after doing the 7 days slow transition to give it another full two weeks on the food - unless you're having explosive diarrhea - to see how they respond to the food.

Hopefully once she's stable you could try going to kibble to help you save some money. Chewy is good about refunding you if the food doesn't work - as long as it's not done a lot. So if the time comes and you try kibble try ordering from Chewy (you can order Sport Dog Food Elite from Chewy).

Sending you hugs!
Madelon, owned by DOC. DOC dx EPI 5/2015 = TLI < .4, B12 406; Folate >24. DOC taught me so much and together we battled and overcame EPI, food sensitivies, environmental allergies but we lost the cancer battle. DOC was dx with hemangiosarcoma 5/2022 and crossed the rainbow bridge July 24, 2022. He is and always will be the love of my life, my soulmate, my heart dog.

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littlegirl_peaches
Member
Posts: 29
Country: United States
State: Utah
Pet name: Peaches
My name: Shasta

Re: Peaches Journey

Post by littlegirl_peaches » 23 Sep 2020, 19:47

Peaches is the same. I am trying not to get worried but it's hard. I cut out the coconut and salmon oil to see if that was part of the issue. So it's been two days... i know not a lot of time but I expected something... to be different. She's been on the tylosin now a week.

Any recommendations on dosing? The vet said 275 mg. I called Vet and I was told 1/4 tsp. Is that really enough? Today i accidentally gave her a dose at midday I gave her her normal night dose just in case. She has moments that I wonder about ear infection as she is doing the typical head shake my oldest used to do when her ears got yeasty. Oddly her ear are spotless. No idea what is going on there. I wiped them out just in case but literally nothing came out.

Her poos is well it's firmer but still soft like warm modeling clay. Still goldenish to tan in color. You can clearly see the connective tissue not digested. The more worrying to me is the size of the poos. So, she's a very slight midrange mutt. Her poos is closer to the size I'd have expected with my full lab who was 70 lbs. Volume is more normal currently for sure but not like it was before the pancreas died out. Maybe I'll start keeping pictures in the spreadsheet where I track her food. It's just the camera isn't great because I've dropped it many times and it's 4 years old now I think. I need to replace it but hadn't planned for EPI but then no one does. i am grateful that I got her and not someone less able because I can only imagine how that would have turned out as it's hard for me and I have more disposable income than some but certainly I need to figure something out sooner than later with finances or we'll be living on the street at retirement. She is the smartest little twit. Annoyingly cute and a snugly tiny ball of love.

Slippery Elm is on the way. I just don't have a feel for what is wrong at this point or even what to change. Do I increase the tylosin? Do I increase the Enzymes? Do I let them sit for longer than 30 mins? Do I change food and if I change food is raw easier to digest than kibble? I didn't know you could send back Kibble. Still doesn't feel right I mean it's not their fault it didn't work nor the food's fault. I mean I know people do it and I had someone at Walmart get after me for not returning something when I mentioned something about an item not working.. and I was like 'you can return stuff to walmart?' I would expect clothing and that sort of thing but for the grocery store? If it's rotten or the package is open somehow and you don't notice it till you get home maybe.. but don't people check that before they pick it up? I can't seem to wrap my brain around returning say CocoPuffs because I didn't like the flavor of the chocolate. If it had weevils .. ok yes that makes sense. Anyhow, we're in the home stretch on only the basic food, tylosin, and ezymes. If her poo, isn't firm tomorrow, I'll make her an appointment for what I don't know but this can't be right. Or do I wait for the Slippery elm and try that a week? She's only gained about .5 pounds maybe 1 .. hard to know as I didn't do a comparison weight from the vet's scale to mine. But if we assume they match exactly and I know they don't she's only put on 1.4 pounds which I know we are off by at least 1 pound. This means she's gained a whooping .4 in more than well I can't even recall. at least two if not three weeks with the enzymes and one with the addition of the tylosin. That doesn't seem right.

Ok well it's feeding time and I'm going to maybe feed her an extra portion because we going to play at the dog park.

Oh and I decided that we going to try Steve's raw. It's local here and reasonably priced. I can transition her now as I have about 10 days worth left of Darwin's and I would think raw to raw should be relatively equal. Thanks everyone!

Can't wait for the calendar.
Herding is groovy,
Peaches
Heeler/Lab mix
DOB: 02/14/20 (6.5 months)
DX: 08/27/20 with EPI. Trypsin = 1.0
Weight PreDX: 28 lbs :: Current Weight: 24 lbs :: Height: 19 in. at shoulder :: Chest at widest: 20 in. :: Waist/Hip: 16 in.
Current Diet - RAW: Darwin's Natural Instinct
Waiting on Enzymes 09/01/20. Can't find local raw pancreas.

Tuckaboo Pam
Member
Posts: 1346
Country: United States
State: Florida
Pet name: Tucker
My name: Pam H.

Re: Peaches Journey

Post by Tuckaboo Pam » 24 Sep 2020, 13:44

I wonder if the color of the poo is related to the diet. I feed Tucker SportDog buffalo & sweet potato, which looks like black bean soup when it's all concocted, and his poo is black like the food. It's never become quite as firm as my other dogs', but it's very pick-upable.

Ear-could something like a bug be in his ear? Does it smell ok? Good you have yeast experience, so you know what you're doing as far as that goes. Again, my guy is allergic to some wildflowers in the yard, so when he walks through them, then scratches near his head, it inflames his ears & makes them itchy. My vet said to pull the weeds, and wash his feet when he comes back inside. Just an idea---Pam
Tucker was a shepherd/lab mix--- TLI 1.3, Folate 9.7, Cobalamin 666, Lipase 38. Took Diane's Enzymes 4 teaspoons/day, Wonderlabs B12 one capsule per day, and Tylan 1/16 teaspoon/ morning (to hold SID at bay). Taste of the Wild High Prairie, 1 1/2 cups/day, with a total of 4 cups of Fresh Pet. Stopped eating everything in sight, and went from 60 to 85 pounds! Tucker was my boyfriend, and my husband was OK with that. Tucker succumbed to hemangiosarcoma, but we cherished every day we had with that wonderful, beautiful boy. I will always, always miss my sweet big boy.

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littlegirl_peaches
Member
Posts: 29
Country: United States
State: Utah
Pet name: Peaches
My name: Shasta

Re: Peaches Journey

Post by littlegirl_peaches » 25 Sep 2020, 02:48

Well Good news ... her poo is finally getting firm and might be decreasing some more in volume. I suppose she processes food slower than I expected. I don't know but it's closer to what I would expect to see. Its still lighter in color than I wonder is good but the test will be when we change food this weekend.

Feed her an scrambled egg w/enzymes last night and will again tonight as a bedtime snack. She's still burping/almost wet burping after playing or at night. Slippery Elm is shipped but it doesn't arrive til midweek next. I am wondering if I could do regular tums or rantidine for the same purpose? Can't use omprozole because Peaches reacted so badly the one time I gave it to her.

The not so good. So, I have had her in shirts and shorts to get her used to them for when she goes into heat. It makes for an adorably cute picture but it also masks her ribbyness. So I stripped her down and weighed her yesterday and she was 24.6 pounds so if my scale is exactly in sync with the Vet she has gained 1.6 pounds but I am pretty sure my scale is 2 pounds heavier. when we were at vet's last she weighed 23 pounds and I had weighed her at home that morning and she was 25. Soooo, she is still ribby but I swear it's a bit less. perhaps it's wishful thinking at this point still--so, I started the egg back yesterday and it has a little bone broth and oil-- Just enough to cook it and mix in enzymes so Peaches will eat it. it weighed 2oz which is equal to one large egg.

So I'm going to change food saturday and go back up to 4 meals a day a bit smaller and see if that helps.. i mean it will be the same or a bit more food she's getting now but i'm going to go with smaller meals. ok off to bed.. gnight everyone.
Herding is groovy,
Peaches
Heeler/Lab mix
DOB: 02/14/20 (6.5 months)
DX: 08/27/20 with EPI. Trypsin = 1.0
Weight PreDX: 28 lbs :: Current Weight: 24 lbs :: Height: 19 in. at shoulder :: Chest at widest: 20 in. :: Waist/Hip: 16 in.
Current Diet - RAW: Darwin's Natural Instinct
Waiting on Enzymes 09/01/20. Can't find local raw pancreas.

Tuckaboo Pam
Member
Posts: 1346
Country: United States
State: Florida
Pet name: Tucker
My name: Pam H.

Re: Peaches Journey

Post by Tuckaboo Pam » 25 Sep 2020, 17:21

The slow weight gain can be so frustrating. I think I would feed her that egg mixture at bedtime, as often as she'll eat it. Best thoughts---Pam & Tucker
Tucker was a shepherd/lab mix--- TLI 1.3, Folate 9.7, Cobalamin 666, Lipase 38. Took Diane's Enzymes 4 teaspoons/day, Wonderlabs B12 one capsule per day, and Tylan 1/16 teaspoon/ morning (to hold SID at bay). Taste of the Wild High Prairie, 1 1/2 cups/day, with a total of 4 cups of Fresh Pet. Stopped eating everything in sight, and went from 60 to 85 pounds! Tucker was my boyfriend, and my husband was OK with that. Tucker succumbed to hemangiosarcoma, but we cherished every day we had with that wonderful, beautiful boy. I will always, always miss my sweet big boy.

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