Sushi's Saga

Epi4Dogs Foundation Inc.’s mission is the advancement of science and education relating to EPI (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency), yielding useful insights and positive outcomes in better managing EPI in dogs and cats. Our goals are to support and/or collaborate with veterinary EPI research and researchers, and to promote EPI awareness by educating the general public, pet owners, pet organizations, rescue and shelter organizations, veterinary schools and veterinarians.
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Olesia711
Founder & Research Director
Posts: 4201
Location: North Carolina
Country: United States
State: North Carolina
Pet name: Izzy
My name: olesia

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by Olesia711 » 30 Nov 2023, 16:36

oh wow! thanks Jeremy for letting us know that the enzyme icing worked out for your Eddie :)
Olesia, was owned by Izzy, a 35lb Spanish Water Dog (SWD), Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.. Izzy passed away on February 13, 2020 at 15 years old. She lived with EPI for 13+1/2 years. It was because of Izzy that Epi4Dogs was started... she was the inspiration. May her legacy of helping others with EPI continue for as long as needed.........

Eddiespaghetti
Member
Posts: 382
Country: United States
State: California
Pet name: Eddie
My name: Jeremy

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by Eddiespaghetti » 30 Nov 2023, 16:42

I did have to give him up to 300 percent his daily recommended caloric intake. After about a month of that, Eddie cut himself back. We now feed him about what he should have daily. He was finally not hungry all the time and only eats twice a day now, if that. He put himself at his ideal weight.
With the icing start with less water and add water as needed to get to the consistency you want. My partner used to be a professional baker. They knew about royal icing and handled it pretty quickly.

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Olesia711
Founder & Research Director
Posts: 4201
Location: North Carolina
Country: United States
State: North Carolina
Pet name: Izzy
My name: olesia

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by Olesia711 » 30 Nov 2023, 16:50

Ahhh you were lucky with Eddie.... i never was able to reduce Izzy's amount of food to "normal" as she forever required more calories to keep the weight stable.

Gotta love these EPI dogs.... did you ever notice how we might try to implement "recommended" protocols... and many of our dogs just don't want to follow the rules????? They sure keep us on our toes!
Olesia, was owned by Izzy, a 35lb Spanish Water Dog (SWD), Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.. Izzy passed away on February 13, 2020 at 15 years old. She lived with EPI for 13+1/2 years. It was because of Izzy that Epi4Dogs was started... she was the inspiration. May her legacy of helping others with EPI continue for as long as needed.........

Eddiespaghetti
Member
Posts: 382
Country: United States
State: California
Pet name: Eddie
My name: Jeremy

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by Eddiespaghetti » 30 Nov 2023, 18:09

Eddie just stopped eating lunch. After 5 days, we were tired of throwing food away. We stopped feeding him lunch, then he stopped eating all his breakfast and dinner so we just cut it back. Now, he barely eats breakfast. He just isn't starving anymore.

Beatrice
Member
Posts: 52
Country: Canada
Pet name: Sushi
My name: Beatrice

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by Beatrice » 11 Apr 2024, 13:11

Hi everyone,

Sushi has been on 1/4 teaspoon of slippery elm since Dec. 22, 2024. Her stomach rumblings, passing gas have improved although not 100% eliminated. Is slippery elm an indefinite thing or should she be gradually weaned down?

I feel that I have finally conquered the enzyme dose and adjustments needed. For example, my husband came home with tiramisu on sale from Costco. I am on a 1500 calories diet so will not touch the cake. Sushi gets a fair share of the cake. (I know we are bad pet owners.) 2 days later, her anus was covered with oil. Poop was formed but somewhat yellow and oily. I stopped the cake one day, no oily anus. I restarted the cake with enzyme capsule prepared for snacks. Although less in intensity, she still had a bit of oily anus. Next day, smaller piece of cake with same amount of enzyme, no oily anus.

After the cake was finished, 2 days later, oily anus again. I started pulling my hair. Then I realized, oh she has been given medium ground beef. She usually gets lean ground beef, chicken or pork. Since at the time, only medium ground beef was on sale, Sushi gets to eat medium. I did think about the grease but didn't adjust the enzymes. So I started to rinse the boiled ground beef with hot water to wash away any grease stuck on the meat and no oily anus since. So from these experience, I need to pay attention to the food and adjust enzyme dosing.

That brings me to another question. It is ideal to get the optimal enzyme dosing and I have always been conservative in adjusting thinking ah, a few thousand lipase less will not make a difference. However, it does make a difference between and oily anus and none. If you need to, is it better to "overdose" than "underdose"?

I will be starting at new pack of enzymediane which has only 94K lipase units. The current pack is 128K which means the potency of the new pack will be 30% less. This means having to adjust up to 30% in the next batch of enzyme capsules. This is going to be fun.
TLI 3.1
1 Pet Factor B12, 1 small scoop of aventi GI complete pre/probiotic, 1/4 teaspoon slippery elm
Enzyme Diane 8X in HPMC delayed release capsule (1 full capsule + 1/2 capsule for each meal)
Nutrience Grain-Free Subzero Prairie Red (up to 2 cups if no other meat given)
AM 1/2 cup of kibble, plain yogourt with 1/2 banana or sweet potato
Noon 1/2 cup of cooked meat + boiled egg
3:30pm 1/2 cup cooked meat + boiled egg
6pm 3/4 cup of cooked meat
9pm 1/2 cup of kibble
apple, peanut butter snacks with enzyme capsule

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jilbert57
Staff
Posts: 2214
Country: United States
State: Washington

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by jilbert57 » 11 Apr 2024, 14:46

That is interesting. Are both strengths on the enzyme bags the same? 6x or 8x?

Mickey had pancreatitis and a consultant here sometimes, Dr. Penny, told me "just because you are using enzymes on his food now doesn't mean you can increase his fat content of his diet". More than 10% fat in his diet despite being on enzymes would cause great pain.

Jill
My name is Jill and we live on the Hood Canal in Washington State. We currently have 2 Jack russells, TJ is 8 and Sadie is 2.

Mickey and his pancreatitis brought me to Epi4dogs.com site in 2012 to help manage it.
He lived from 6/99 - 8/2014

Mickey, Jack Russell. Chronic Pancreatitis. Dianes enzymes, 1/8t 3x/day with meals.

Beatrice
Member
Posts: 52
Country: Canada
Pet name: Sushi
My name: Beatrice

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by Beatrice » 11 Apr 2024, 16:10

jilbert57 wrote: 11 Apr 2024, 14:46 That is interesting. Are both strengths on the enzyme bags the same? 6x or 8x?

Mickey had pancreatitis and a consultant here sometimes, Dr. Penny, told me "just because you are using enzymes on his food now doesn't mean you can increase his fat content of his diet". More than 10% fat in his diet despite being on enzymes would cause great pain.

Jill

They're both 8X. I really never paid attention to the lipase units until this last one. The label does say can use 20% less. I did not. Sushi's poop were great the majority of the times.
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TLI 3.1
1 Pet Factor B12, 1 small scoop of aventi GI complete pre/probiotic, 1/4 teaspoon slippery elm
Enzyme Diane 8X in HPMC delayed release capsule (1 full capsule + 1/2 capsule for each meal)
Nutrience Grain-Free Subzero Prairie Red (up to 2 cups if no other meat given)
AM 1/2 cup of kibble, plain yogourt with 1/2 banana or sweet potato
Noon 1/2 cup of cooked meat + boiled egg
3:30pm 1/2 cup cooked meat + boiled egg
6pm 3/4 cup of cooked meat
9pm 1/2 cup of kibble
apple, peanut butter snacks with enzyme capsule

User avatar
Olesia711
Founder & Research Director
Posts: 4201
Location: North Carolina
Country: United States
State: North Carolina
Pet name: Izzy
My name: olesia

Re: Sushi's Saga

Post by Olesia711 » 11 Apr 2024, 23:08

Okay.... so i am probably going to make your head spin even more............. different types of fat can also make a dramatic difference.

And i swear there is something about beef fat...my current dog, who is not an EPI dog....now at 3yrs old, doesn't have dietary issues.... HOWEVER.... i can give him a large amount of 90/10% fat beef... but if i give him 70/30% fat beef i have to be real careful not to give him too much or else it will give him loose stools. And yet he can have lots of other types of with no issues.... like butter, heavy cream , etc, etc...

SO... just saying... maybe it could also have something to do with the type of fat (long chain fat???)
Olesia, was owned by Izzy, a 35lb Spanish Water Dog (SWD), Diagnosed at 1.5 years old - TLI results 1.. Izzy passed away on February 13, 2020 at 15 years old. She lived with EPI for 13+1/2 years. It was because of Izzy that Epi4Dogs was started... she was the inspiration. May her legacy of helping others with EPI continue for as long as needed.........

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