For those of you with puppies...

[LisaDorn2024]

How do you engage your puppies in obedience training sessions, brain games, snuffle mats, etc when digestive enzymes are needed (and Levi takes Creon which is not soaked into the kibble?)

He is still a puppy who need to have things to chew on, games to play and obedience training to take place (Thank goodness he earned his Canine Good Citizen title before getting really sick.) I feel so badly for him as a big part of his life was about earning treats and chewing on bully sticks, buffalo cheeks, icelandic cod skins, etc. He is highly food motivated since he is a golden retriever. It's kind of like a child who has lost all of his favorite toys and privileges, but doesn't know why. Since he is allergic to all protein sources the only thing he can eat right now is the Ultamino kibble (the vet has not cleared him for fruits or vegetables yet) so I have to find a way to give him little bits as treats in between meals so he can still have fun, but I do not know how to do the Creon enzymes. Please help. Thank you!

[jilbert57]

I would do training right after a meal while he still has enzymes from his meal in him. If you feed 3 times a day train close to a meal. Get him used to ice chips as treats.
You could try a bully stick after an enzymed meal, or at least part of a bully stick. Sorry I don't have more ideas.

Jill

[LisaDorn2024]

I would do training right after a meal while he still has enzymes from his meal in him. If you feed 3 times a day train close to a meal. Get him used to ice chips as treats.
You could try a bully stick after an enzymed meal, or at least part of a bully stick. Sorry I don't have more ideas.

Jill

Thank you, Jill, for sharing the ideas you did have. It's challenging to come up with creative ideas for puppies with EPI Levi gets a bowl of ice chips for dessert after each meal to make sure the digestive enzymes are washed out of his mouth. He cannot have a bully stick because that is beef (a protein source.) Fingers crossed that one day I can surprise him with one! I could do organized 5 minutes training sessions after meals, but I was thinking in regards to those "teachable moments" that pop up in the life of a puppy where you catch them being mischievous and you need to address it in the moment.
The good news is Levi has great poops now. Once I took him off of the Purina HA hydrolyzed protein and gave him 100% Ultamino, things improved immediately. Now we are working on the lymphoplasmacytics infiltrates in his stomach and small intestines and the eosinophilic enteritis that has now spread throughout his entire GI system - starting in his throat all the way to his lower intestines trying to address the inflammation and the pain.

[Dan_L]

Though this was several years ago but I was heavily involved in training with one of my German Shepherds. We did basic and advance obedience, basic and advance personal protection, basic drug detection, ground tracking, and air scent tracking. Never once did we rely on treats. From day one we always used an abundance of positive verbal and physical praise for a positive performance. Because of the nature of much of the training we’d avoid treats to ensure they did not always expect a food treat for obedience.

Now having said that I think there are almost as many perspectives on the best way to give positive reinforcement as there are trainers but I can see verbal and physical praise possibly being a strong option when it comes to a pet with EPI.

Again, this is my personal experience with training Max and I’ve used the same philosophy for teaching basics to all of my other fur kids.

[LisaDorn2024]

Though this was several years ago but I was heavily involved in training with one of my German Shepherds. We did basic and advance obedience, basic and advance personal protection, basic drug detection, ground tracking, and air scent tracking. Never once did we rely on treats. From day one we always used an abundance of positive verbal and physical praise for a positive performance. Because of the nature of much of the training we’d avoid treats to ensure they did not always expect a food treat for obedience.

Now having said that I think there are almost as many perspectives on the best way to give positive reinforcement as there are trainers but I can see verbal and physical praise possibly being a strong option when it comes to a pet with EPI.

Again, this is my personal experience with training Max and I’ve used the same philosophy for teaching basics to all of my other fur kids.

Thank you, Dan. Yes, there are so many different methods and philosophies when it comes to dog training. I kind of wish I had started Levi with just using verbal praise, but it's in my nature to spoil my animals to the max so it was just as much fun for me as it was for Levi to get treats. Now that he has experienced training with treats (and I mean he earned a treat for everything!) He was a super star in every obedience class we took because he was getting pieces of cooked wild salmon or grass fed steaks and would do anything for a treat. Every dog in the class was my new best friend. LOL. I was determined that Levi was going to have healthy, real food one ingredient treats so he did not develop any allergies or health issues. So much for that school of thought, right? Overall, he has done extremely well with training especially now that I know he was sick and in pain the entire time. He is not very happy with his new life situation. It is like going from the Ritz Carlton to Motel 6! A lot of his pleasures in life involved earning treats and enjoying his favorites chews so he is testing boundaries which never happened before. I know he is in his teenage phase of puppyhood which only complicates it. Once he can eat fruits and vegetables again, he will enjoy getting those as treats. I just don't know how to use the Creon with small amounts of treats throughout the day. Thank you!

[Michaela]

Some treat ideas: https://epi4dogs.com/treats/

[LisaDorn2024]

Some treat ideas: https://epi4dogs.com/treats/

Thank you, Michaela, for sharing this link. I did see this on the EPI4Dogs website, but many of the ingredients have not been medically cleared for Levi to have at this time. He has 2 serious IBD diagnoses in addition to the EPI and they actually cause him a lot more challenges. Then he is allergic to all proteins and other foods, too. His immune system seems to see the entire world as a threat. These are great ideas for the future...I hope. I need to find something he can chew on (he is a super chewer) - The only chew is allowed to have right now are goat horns and he just started reacting to them the past 2 days...I guess its the marrow inside of the horns that is triggering the vomiting. He is such a good puppy and at 10 months he has never once chewed on anything in the house that was not his. I would like to keep it that way! Thank you so much.

[Olesia711]

Lisa,

I used limited treats with Izzy when i first started on the EPI journey.... after she was stable with the EPI..... and she was very food motivated.... BUT..... i applaud Dan's input regarding rewarding with praise - -something other than a treat - - because thinking back.... i did back off from using food as treat and slowly segued into using a tuggy rope as a reward .... and it worked fabulously!!!! Izzy was thrilled to be rewarded with "interaction" with me.. and that was part of playing tuggy with her.... instead of a food reward..... and we only tugged for a few seconds.

Might want to look at hiding things and then rewarding with a game of tuggy or something Levi might like doing.

ALso.... if he does naughty things... like stealing dirty laundry.... use that as a teaching moment... to "carry it" ...and then don't chase him but rather you run in the opposite direction and have him bring it back to you... and reward him with a tuggy or something.......

or... teach him to pick up and put away his toys............

Just some thoughts

[LisaDorn2024]

Lisa,

I used limited treats with Izzy when i first started on the EPI journey.... after she was stable with the EPI..... and she was very food motivated.... BUT..... i applaud Dan's input regarding rewarding with praise - -something other than a treat - - because thinking back.... i did back off from using food as treat and slowly segued into using a tuggy rope as a reward .... and it worked fabulously!!!! Izzy was thrilled to be rewarded with "interaction" with me.. and that was part of playing tuggy with her.... instead of a food reward..... and we only tugged for a few seconds.

Might want to look at hiding things and then rewarding with a game of tuggy or something Levi might like doing.

ALso.... if he does naughty things... like stealing dirty laundry.... use that as a teaching moment... to "carry it" ...and then don't chase him but rather you run in the opposite direction and have him bring it back to you... and reward him with a tuggy or something.......

or... teach him to pick up and put away his toys............

Just some thoughts

Thank you, Olesia, for these ideas. One has to be VERY creative once a dog has gotten used to high value treats.

[Tuckaboo Pam]

Every summer the K9 unit comes to our summer camp to put on a show for the kids, and the only reward those dogs get (GSDs and Malinois) is a ball to hold in their mouth. They are so excited when it is given to them. ---Pam