New member introduction

[Olesia711]

Hi,

As Jill explained, the 1/8 of a tsp of Tylan powder is the correct amount. Be sure to give it twice a day (Breakfast & Dinner)and give it for 45 days.
The Beaphor 10 is a multivitamin which is perfectly fine to continue giving.
Kibble is fine but usually what work best s one that has a low fiber content, again, like Jill said, 4% or less fiber content seems to work better with most (but not all) EPI dogs. Many of our dogs, once on enzymes do not do as well with a lot of grain in their food....this is why we say if you are going to feed kibble or any commercial food, try to give something with 4% or less fiber.

Yes, kibble is more rounded as far as a more balance of vitamins and minerals .. but on the flip side, home-made food is often healthier because it is not processed to where a lot of the nutrients are destroyed... but then when doing home-made, you are not sure if you are properly covering the right amount of needed vitamins and minerals... and this is why if doing home-made we recommend giving good quality doggie vitamins, fish oil / EFA essential fattys acids and bone matter of some sort, whether actual bones, bone meal, egg shells or some sort of bone matter that is appropriate.

With EPI dog, above and beyond giving them a regular vitamin, there is research out there now that has proven that EPI dogs are greatly lacking n fat soluble vitamins. So, like with my gal, she gets a good doggie vitamin but on top of that i still give her EFA capsule every day, and 3 days a week she gets vitamin E, and B12.

[nala_indie]

Hi Nala,

I can help answer a few questions.
My Kiya is 39.0 pounds and gets 1/8 teaspoon Tylan 2 times a day. You are giving the correct dose.

Kibble is a fine meal following the grain free 4% fiber or less protocol. It all comes down to what your dog will eat and thrive on. Kibble, home cooked, canned just what works best for your dog. Please remember enzymes are not a supplement but a necessity in EPI. Every piece of food needs enzymes

As far as veggies, just keep in mind evtra fiber. I would think all those veggies are fine. Broccoli can be gas producing keep in mind.

Jill

Thank you so much Jill

[nala_indie]

Hi,

As Jill explained, the 1/8 of a tsp of Tylan powder is the correct amount. Be sure to give it twice a day (Breakfast & Dinner)and give it for 45 days.
The Beaphor 10 is a multivitamin which is perfectly fine to continue giving.
Kibble is fine but usually what work best s one that has a low fiber content, again, like Jill said, 4% or less fiber content seems to work better with most (but not all) EPI dogs. Many of our dogs, once on enzymes do not do as well with a lot of grain in their food....this is why we say if you are going to feed kibble or any commercial food, try to give something with 4% or less fiber.

Yes, kibble is more rounded as far as a more balance of vitamins and minerals .. but on the flip side, home-made food is often healthier because it is not processed to where a lot of the nutrients are destroyed... but then when doing home-made, you are not sure if you are properly covering the right amount of needed vitamins and minerals... and this is why if doing home-made we recommend giving good quality doggie vitamins, fish oil / EFA essential fattys acids and bone matter of some sort, whether actual bones, bone meal, egg shells or some sort of bone matter that is appropriate.

With EPI dog, above and beyond giving them a regular vitamin, there is research out there now that has proven that EPI dogs are greatly lacking n fat soluble vitamins. So, like with my gal, she gets a good doggie vitamin but on top of that i still give her EFA capsule every day, and 3 days a week she gets vitamin E, and B12.

Thanks Olesia, Nala's been on Tylan for about a week now, her poop has been consistent, with no surprises, but it's still not hard and brown. She'll get her 2nd B12 shot today. She seemed to have put on about 1 kilo. Continuing with Creon 25k for every meal.
I'll try working with her diet and extra vitamins like you suggested after a weeks time untill she's stable. Shall keep you guys posted.
Thanks a Ton.

[Madelon]

Is there a reason for the 25,000 Creon? I think most start out using the 10,000 - too much enzymes is as bad as too little - bad poops.

[nala_indie]

Is there a reason for the 25,000 Creon? I think most start out using the 10,000 - too much enzymes is as bad as too little - bad poops.

Thanks for reaching out Madelon. So we started off with Creon 10k but her poops were still loose and greasy, so my vet suggested me to increase the dosage to 25k.
I am yet to get her tests done. It's been about 30 days now she's been on tylosin, she has put on a little weight.

[Madelon]

Here is some information on Creon from our Enzyme Page - I'm still wondering if the Creon 25,000 is too much - maybe try giving 2 Creon 10,000 as suggested below. Are you planning on getting the EPI test done? It's not recommended to treat as EPI for too long without the test to know for sure that your dog has EPI and not some other condition that EPI symptoms mimic.

CREON (available world-wide!!!!)

These are enteric coated microspheres of enzymes encased in capsules. These capsules may be given whole or sprinkled on food if served immediately. Alternately, some people find that after giving Creon waiting for a period (5, 10 or 15 minutes) before feeding is more effective. Every dog is different and experimentation is required to find the most effective method. Please note: if you are going to sprinkle the contents ensure that the dog eats the entire meal so that all of the Creon is ingested. If in doubt, give the capsule whole before trying the sprinkling method.

CREON is commonly used in many places outside the U.S. Existing CREON enzyme capsule products vary from region to region with not all strengths available in all regions. They can come in 5 , 6, 10, 12, 25, 40 strengths and new strengths approved as of 2009 of 6, 12, strengths are becoming more readily available mainly in the US. When initially treating an EPI dog, it is recommended to start with CREON 12 or CREON 10 which has 10,000 USP of Lipase, 37,500 USP of Protease, 33,200 USP of Amylase. There is some latitude using Creon as its effectiveness is dependent on the dog’s pH level (you do not need to test for this) so getting the exact strength is not strictly necessary.

The CREON the potency measurement comparison is as follows:

CREON 10 Composition : 150 mg Pancreatin
Amylase 8,000 PhEur units (BP Units) also equals 33,400 USP units
Lipase 10,000 PhEur units (BP Units) also equals 10,000 USP units
Protease 600 Ph Eur units (BP units) also equal 37,500 USP units

CREON 25 Composition : 300 mg Pancreatin
Amylase 18,000 PhEur units (BP Units) also equals 74,700 USP units
Lipase 25,000 PhEur units (BP Units) also equals 25,000 USP units
Protease 1,000 Ph Eur units (BP units) also equal 62,500 USP units

However… please know, once you start with a particular brand of CREON and it works… TRY NOT TO SWITCH brands!!!! “There are so many variables with prescriptions for CREON from different countries. Different countries fill the CREON differently. It is not regulated like medicine for hypertension etc. Changing from one CREON made by Abbott opposed to CREON made by Mylan as an example will vary very much. It is strongly suggested that when you use a particular CREON made by a particular company …. stick with the one and do not try to use or vary them from one company or the another unless the amounts are exactly the same as you have been using and working for your pet.

A 2012 Research Study on the use of enteric coated enzymes (CREON, LYPEX, etc) for EPI dogs:
http://www.biomedcentral.com/1746-6148/8/127/abstract

Giving CREON is not straight-forward…. the pet owner will have to trial and error to find the right dose and the right administration technique. The following is a little guidance on how to do this:

The trick to giving CREON is make sure that its activation starts at the right time while going thru the digestive system- -and that will depend on each dog’s very own pH level in their digestive tract / small intestine.. So…. it is all based on what your dog’s pH level is, not his size nor the amount of food given…. and this is why it takes a little trial and error with these dogs when placed on CREON.

First…. the dose. We suggest starting with a CREON 10,000 (or 12,000) per meal (you can add more if this amount doesn’t work)

Next… the technique…. the best way is to just try the following techniques to see which works best … and that is determined by the poo quality:

1. Give the CREON 10,000 (or 12,000) capsule whole or sprinkle the contents and feed immediately or wait for 10 minutes before feeding (some dogs respond better with either method). Watch the poo for a few days and try to assess. Please note: if you are going to sprinkle the contents ensure that the dog eats the entire meal so that all of the Creon is ingested. If in doubt, give the capsule whole before trying the sprinkling method.

2. if the above does not produce optimal poo results, then you can try 2 x CREON 10,000 (or 12,000) capsules. Watch the poo for a few days and try to assess if this helped, or if it is just right or not working at all….

3. if the above is not working at all…. then try giving a CREON 10,000 (or 12,000) capsule about 5 minutes prior to a meal… again, watch the poo and try to assess if this appears to work better than the above or not. If it does appear to work better…. but still isn’t perfect, then try giving the CREON 10,000 (or 12,000) about 10 minutes prior to a meal and again assess the poo over the next few days.

These are some techniques… the trick in giving CREON will be up to you to try and figure out TWO THINGS!

1. what is the best “timing” method of giving CREON.. whole in capsules or in some cases whether opened and served immediately or 5, 10 or 15 minutes prior to a meal.

2. and then the right “dose”… whether one CREON 10,000 (or 12,000) is enough or if you need two CREON 10,000 (or 12,000)… or if your dog is going to need approximately CREON 25,000 .

Some comparisons regarding CREON (Spring 2018):

(CREON) in Canada… YOUR CANADA DRUG STORE…www.YCDSCC.com